Vegan Bodybuilding & Fitness

Healthy Food Defines You
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PostPosted: Tue Dec 20, 2005 12:19 pm 
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Manatee
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Thanks, yes it's a pain in the butt. But there are a lot of worse things that could happen to me. I'm alive, right? :D

Thanks for your support. You show a real passion for your convictions and your (and others') posts really open my eyes to what I never really thought about what happens in certain industries. I wasn't totally oblivious (I've read Diet for a new America, Fast Food Nation and am pretty conscious of my consumer habits) but really never thought about some things...

Cheers


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PostPosted: Tue Dec 20, 2005 12:37 pm 
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ljk11 wrote:
flanders77 wrote:
Quote:
I have a nasty digestive system. Egg whites don't upset it and are a great protein source.
What do you mean by "nasty". What does not upset it?


By nasty, I mean many foods upset my whole digestive system. It becomes a challenge to eat. Right now I'm back into the "I'd rather be hungry than deal with the results of what happens when I eat." (booo)
I've looked into things for many years and it's a whole other story. My GP hasn't been all that helpful. Soon I'm seeing a very good doctor who I have been referred to who I'm really confident will figure me out. She is renowned for it and has helped a lot of people get their lives back so to speak.

I've learned through a lot of experimenting that I should avoid wheat, oats, gluten, and pretty much all grains. I don't know why but they kill me. Dairy is out (a non issue here!) as well.

Well, here is what I can eat without getting basically incapacitated by cramps, gas, bloating and a lot of digestive, er "issues":
eggs, fish, chicken (clearly unvegan)
-some fruit (not mangoes, not pineapple - darn, they're so good)
-cooked vegetables (broccoli, spinach, cauliflower, etc. and I LOVE veggies)
- squash and sweet potatoes
-Soy protein powder isolate
-Tofu - however I hear too much soy has its own health pitfalls
- tempeh / LOVE IT
- hemp protein (but it's so grainy....can you help?)
- Beans and lentils in moderation -
-healthy fats like nuts and good oils
- Normal things like spices, seasonings, miso, vinegar, mustard etc...
I'm a great cook and am willing to spend time preparing things.

Please do inform me about how the debate started. Why do bodybuilders/physique athletes place so much emphasis on high protein if it really doesn't matter? I agree first and foremost is to eat ENOUGH calories, but doesn't the relative ratio of the macronutrients also play a key role in body composition/muscle recovery? I am interested in being unbrainwashed about the protein. I do think it's important to get some at each meal, I find if you eat all carbs and nothing else that you get hungry waaaay faster... no? Doesn't protein slow the digestion of the carbs?
Quote:
If you eat a great variaty of vegan UNPROCESSED food it i
s just not possible to get to little protein. When you get informed how the whole "high-quality-protein-debate" started (2 scientist, some rats and egg protein :wink: ) about 100 years or so ago, you will recognise that wasting your time with thinking about it is rather silly... :wink:"


In my idiotic opinion, your diet sounds fine to me, and I really believe that if you cut out the eggs, chicken and fish, you wouldn't find yourself lacking protein. You have a great variety of proteins in your diet, and especially with isolate powder, you can easily get what you need in my opinion. But don't necessarily listen to me, I'm not a profesh bodybuilder or nutrition expert. Maybe you could try it for say 2 or 3 weeks, without the eggs and chicken and fish, and see if you notice fatigue etc? I can't imagine this would happen


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PostPosted: Tue Dec 20, 2005 1:00 pm 
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Yes, MEAT definitely has to go -- no matter what, unless one is in a life or death situation.

Here is what fuels my passion Lauren. Please view this in it's entirety. It is only about 12 minutes long, but something that all consumers should be aware of:

http://www.petatv.com/tvpopup/Prefs.asp ... _your_meat


Good luck in your transition to be as vegan as possible. We are always here for you when you need support. :D

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PostPosted: Tue Dec 20, 2005 2:50 pm 
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Manatee
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I think I'd be fine - Richard...
I just get tired of having soy isolate (bleck) shakes so often. (puretrim is tasty but five bucks vs. 50 cents...when I have a mortage...can't do that...)
Does soy have health risks if consumed in too large a quantity?

I add cinnamon and make it like 'pudding'...I can deal with it but some days it's like...GAAAAAG me.....no more protein powder...


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PostPosted: Wed Dec 21, 2005 3:07 am 
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Elephant
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Location: Muenster, Germany
Quote:
By nasty, I mean many foods upset my whole digestive system. It becomes a challenge to eat. Right now I'm back into the "I'd rather be hungry than deal with the results of what happens when I eat." (booo)
I've looked into things for many years and it's a whole other story. My GP hasn't been all that helpful. Soon I'm seeing a very good doctor who I have been referred to who I'm really confident will figure me out. She is renowned for it and has helped a lot of people get their lives back so to speak.

That really is a bad situation! I hope the doctor is able to help!

Quote:
I've learned through a lot of experimenting that I should avoid wheat, oats, gluten, and pretty much all grains. I don't know why but they kill me. Dairy is out (a non issue here!) as well.

Be sure: You really do not need them!

Quote:
Well, here is what I can eat without getting basically incapacitated by cramps, gas, bloating and a lot of digestive, er "issues":
eggs, fish, chicken (clearly unvegan)
-some fruit (not mangoes, not pineapple - darn, they're so good)
-cooked vegetables (broccoli, spinach, cauliflower, etc. and I LOVE veggies)
- squash and sweet potatoes
-Soy protein powder isolate
-Tofu - however I hear too much soy has its own health pitfalls
- tempeh / LOVE IT
- hemp protein (but it's so grainy....can you help?)
- Beans and lentils in moderation -
-healthy fats like nuts and good oils
- Normal things like spices, seasonings, miso, vinegar, mustard etc...
I'm a great cook and am willing to spend time preparing things.

When I look at this list I really do not see the problem. You can get all your nutrients (yes protein also :wink: ) from the things it contains.

Quote:
Please do inform me about how the debate started. Why do bodybuilders/physique athletes place so much emphasis on high protein if it really doesn't matter?

Here are some interesting links which authosrs explain the whole debate very good:
http://www.afpafitness.com/articles/ProteinRequie.htm
http://www.fatfree.com/FAQ/protein-myths
http://www.vegansociety.com/html/food/n ... rotein.php
http://www.charliesgym.info/wst_page2.html

Also read this. Maybe it opens your eyes in a more scientific way...

Quote:
Where do you get 10.9%?
I see 48 cals out of 52 cals from protein for egg whites...that's over 90% from cals from protein.
Whereas the tofu has 36 out of 96 cals from protein, meaning less than half?

The % is calculated from grams. Maybe if you take calories in consideration of course tofu has less calories-% from protein. But absolutely it has 10,4 % Protein and additionally healthy non-animal fats and other indegrients. Do not get to concerned about that whole tofu-is-unhealthy-debate. It is shown over and pver again that soy protects from many deseases.
Nevertheless you can leave out soy as well. Just remember: Eat enough, eat a geat variety of fresh fruit, vegs, nuts and sprouts and stop worrying so much about getting enough. Just Enjoy eating.

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PostPosted: Wed Dec 21, 2005 9:49 am 
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Manatee
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Thank you - I have a bit of an obsession with food. (Can you tell?!)

I am very detail oriented about most things in life and am working on learning to relax and let go about a lot of things many people wouldn't even think twice about. :roll: :P :D


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PostPosted: Wed Dec 21, 2005 2:20 pm 
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Rabbit
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Location: Los Angeles
Hi Lauren, I was also worried about trying to get enough protien with my lifestyle, sooo I hear ya!! and Im also wierd about food ect. due to my past struggles with an ed. I have a hard time making myself eat enough. Anyway.... on to protien, if you're training on season you should be consuming anywhere from 1.75 to 2.0 grams of protien per pound of body weight. off season anywhere from 1.25 to 1.5 grams pf protien. So you need to figure out where you fall in these two catagories right now.I really think you can work it out it will just take a little more planning maybe in the meal preperation department. it is difficult to get advise on this topic due to the fact that most athletes achieve their protien goals with meat included, and no one wants to hear the " you dont eat meat?!?!?" question. I think you will find valid info here, be it based on health reasons or ethic, to help you make a transition if that is your choice. .. and you wont be judged.


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PostPosted: Wed Dec 21, 2005 9:57 pm 
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Manatee
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THanks and nice to see you here.
But honestly, 2 g of protein per lb of bodyweight seems excessive to me.
It becomes an expensive form of carbohydrate...I sure can't see myself eating 240 g of protein a day.
:shock: That would be 960 cals from protein.
Considering I eat about 1500 (approx.) per day...that leaves 600 cals for fat and carbs ...

I would say 2 g / lb of protein for most is not warranted...


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PostPosted: Thu Dec 22, 2005 4:19 am 
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Elephant
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Location: Gothenburg, Sweden, Europe
I don't like to eat too much soy either. I feel a whole lot better when I use pea protein, it's much easier on the digestive system (at least to me).
I assume you live in Scandinavia? In that case you can't buy it in a store, as far as I know. I buy 5kg buckets from:
Nutrisport


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PostPosted: Thu Dec 22, 2005 9:31 am 
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Manatee
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Me? Scandinavian?
Um - nope. I'm Canadian. Never been to Norway.


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PostPosted: Thu Dec 22, 2005 4:37 pm 
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Rabbit
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Hi Lauren, I think I remembered those mumbers out of my text on athlete nutrition..but yes the numbers seem high to me also. everything I find shows anywhere from 1.2 to 2.0. I know I dont consume this much protien myself, and I believe it to be realted to how much training you are doing. I do however think its possible to get the protien you need without the fish in your diet. good luck with those stomach issues.


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PostPosted: Thu Dec 22, 2005 6:56 pm 
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Elephant
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if i had to eat 2g per lb of bodyweight of protein a day, id be eating nearly 500g! :shock:

i have found little to support the notion that you need that much. i do think though that eating too little protein can affect how much mass you gain. i do not think though that it affects strength. i have made equally good gains in strength on either 100g or 250g of protein a day. i just dont gain mass as well.

IMO 1g per pound of bodyweight is more than enough. i usually dont have that much myself. ordinarily id maybe get 175-225g a day at 235lb bodyweight.

jonathan

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