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 Post subject: Finding it impossible to bulk cleanly
PostPosted: Sun Jun 03, 2012 10:14 am 
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Finch

Joined: Wed Mar 14, 2012 8:10 am
Posts: 8
Just as a quick preempt I don't want to come across as an overly skinny guy who eats next to nothing wondering why he don't have 19" arms overnight. I'm not an ectomorph. I still make slight gains but I have been caught up with the idea of 'lean gains' in the past, and it was only when I realised this mindset was extremely limiting in terms of size that I also realised bulking on a vegan diet is not as easy I thought it would be. I was making gains; pleased with my progress over weeks, but looking back over a period of a few months, there's clearly not been enough going in.

I just can't get enough calories from the quality whole foods I love to eat. My major carb sources: beans, oats, lentils, quinoa, rice, even brown pasta, bread etc.; I simply can't eat enough for me to put on weight and move above around 3500 calories and really add to my frame.
If I didn't want to have a nice body and build strength, I would definitely be a fruitarian. That should give you an idea as to how much I don't like eating shit.

I'm looking for ideas of less healthy vegan options (hurts to even say it) to help me get some serious size and thickness. I've studied my trusty Tesco vegan .pdf and found a few processed options, stuff like hash browns and there's a few frozen burgers available, but is this really the right way to go? I've seen people on forums who claim to blend a 700g tub of Swedish Glace vegan ice cream with a whole jar of peanut butter, and eat this every day. I mean that's 3500 calories on its own, but really? I don't have anything against processed food, I used to live off it before I became interested in fitness but now it's just not a part of my diet at all, other than tofu etc. and I don't want or feel the urge to go near it on the whole.

If you'd like to share your favoured dirtier bulking foods, easy calorie sources etc. then I'd love to hear them.
Cheers.


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 Post subject: Re: Finding it impossible to bulk cleanly
PostPosted: Sun Jun 03, 2012 10:38 am 
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Elephant
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Joined: Thu Apr 07, 2011 4:10 am
Posts: 2138
Location: New Jersey, USA
Why don't you increase your peanut butter and nuts? almonds, cashews, walnuts, pine nuts, pecans, omg yum! white and sweet potatoes, high calorie but clean with nutrients..and nuts go down so easy at least for me. you can eat a ton of them without even realizing. maybe raisins or other dried fruit mixed with them, a yummy trail mix but still relatively unprocessed from the earth. maybe add some olive oil to your beans. maybe some maple or agave syrup with your oats. fruits juices. cous cous mixed with walnuts is bangin, throw on some sea salt....i only get to eat 1/6 of one cup dry, but i could easily eat a cup of it it just tastes so good. it also cooks fast, you just need to throw some boiling water on top and let it sit for 5 minutes.
how much do you weigh and are you getting at least one gram of protein per pound?
you dont want to go to the dirty bulk route. i did and it was a nightmare and took 4 months of dieting and excessive amounts of cardio to undo!!!! you will also spend a lot of your money. whether or not you get fat you will be putting a lot of garbage in your body that could mess with you internally. i was ashamed at how bad i made vegans look. i'm out to prove that vegans can have muscle, but at that point i was also working to confirm that vegans can also be overweight in a bad way. im about to compete in my first bodybuilding competition and im already planning a clean rebound/maintenance/summer diet and im really excited/jealous of your problem haha! i'm craving generous amounts of rice, beans, sweet potatoes, oats, fruits, veggies, but ive learned that not going overboard on carbs is important. granted i'm a tiny female. im planning on 230 carbs, 130 protein (i'm 119 lbs now), and 63 fat. sorry enough about me.
where do you live? if you want me to recommend delicious dirty vegan foods i can...that is if you live in the states... maybe you can incorporate some clif builders bars. if you find them on sale they can be cheap and have 20g protein and a ton of carbs and sugar, not sure on the amount...and they taste good and they are convenient. but you know how they did that experiment with leaving mcdonalds food out for like years and how it maintained the same look due to preservatives? i did a similar experiment with a clif builders bar and had the same results!

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 Post subject: Re: Finding it impossible to bulk cleanly
PostPosted: Sun Jun 03, 2012 10:48 am 
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Manatee
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Joined: Tue Apr 17, 2012 10:57 am
Posts: 377
Location: Vancouver, Canada
Not sure if you consider protein powders sh*t or not, but sunwarrior is suppose to be organic raw vegan. You can add nut butters, chia and flax to your shakes (all high calorie foods) and apparently tofu can make a smoothy quite creamy (I haven't tried tofu yet). The calories in a shake can add up big time - which is why I only have one or 2 a week myself.

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 Post subject: Re: Finding it impossible to bulk cleanly
PostPosted: Sun Jun 03, 2012 1:55 pm 
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Gorilla
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Joined: Mon Oct 17, 2011 6:01 pm
Posts: 876
Location: England
Though I love nuts, they're relatively pretty crap for protein, I use them as a fat source like most.

A rule I followed was 2g of protein per body lb & 100g of carbs per meal, roughly. Drink a lot of your fav milk (if it's soya then switch).....also have a slice of pizza or two with your last "main" meal of the day.

You simply have to eat, I can't put it in any other context. If you're struggling then eat a lot of rich/high calorie foods. This can help a lot.   

Though it's obvious you want gains to be as lean as possible, in an ideal world where your nutrition is bang on, training awesome & getting loads of sleep you can hope to gain 0.25lb of muscle a month at a maximum. I personally sent down the line of getting weight on my frame, worked well for me. Stop thinking & just eat a lot of good food. You will get use to it, it just takes time. Gradually increase portions/frequency.

From what you say, regular small meals may work, for me that method was useless.....

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 Post subject: Re: Finding it impossible to bulk cleanly
PostPosted: Sun Jun 03, 2012 3:06 pm 
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Manatee

Joined: Wed Mar 14, 2012 8:05 pm
Posts: 225
Location: USA
If you are just looking for extra calories, I would agree with jungle, go with the nuts or nut butters. That would be much healthier way to go than the foods you mentioned trying like the hash browns and ice cream. By adding the nuts/nut butters, surely you could get in 3500 calories a day.

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 Post subject: Re: Finding it impossible to bulk cleanly
PostPosted: Sun Jun 03, 2012 3:39 pm 
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Elephant
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Joined: Sun Dec 23, 2007 7:38 am
Posts: 1150
Location: Turku, Finland
Use high quality oil (olive oil, cold-pressed coconut oil) ect. in your diet.

Oils have 900 kCal per 100ml, you can add 1000 kCal in your diet within seconds. Also, it will make your food taste super good. Especially salads and such.

Also, nuts have huge amounts of calories. Para, cashew, macadamia, walnut ect. will make your bulking both easier and tastier. Not that cheap though.

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 Post subject: Re: Finding it impossible to bulk cleanly
PostPosted: Mon Jun 04, 2012 8:13 am 
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Rabbit
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Joined: Thu Mar 08, 2012 7:20 pm
Posts: 176
Location: Dayton, OH
I'm confused as to why you can't get more than 3500 cals. The processed crap and nut butters mentioned might help you put on some fat, but they aren't going to help you put on muscle. The "real" food you mentioned probably will. World class BBer's and powerlifters are eating 6000+ cals/day to bulk up. Why are you only able to eat 3500/day? I use 4000 as a minimum, and I keep a fruit based diet.

Also, you mentioned seeing results over weeks and months. Seasoned lifters see results over a number of months on the bar, and an even larger number of months in ibs of muscle. If you've been doing this for more than a year, you can't expect much more than that, and if you haven't you're about to be a little disappointed in how real progress happens. Unless you are super human in which case I would love to hook up and get your autograph before you get too famous.

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