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 Post subject: 45 minutes a week training
PostPosted: Sun Jul 31, 2005 5:15 pm 
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Manatee
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I train 3 times a week, for about 15 minutes. I just do breast and triceps on one day and biceps, shoulders and back on anonther day. The third training day I just do every excercise with very little weight, and I do my back if I forgot that the other day. Each muscle group I just do 1 set warming up and 1 set with the weight with wich I can do about 8 reps. After a few months I do another excercise for all the muscles to stop the muscles from getting lazy, except for breasts I only use bench press. Abdominals I just train during my martial arts training, and legs also.

I have been training for 1,5 years now, and can see some results. I am just wandering if anyone else on this forum has used a simular training method, and dit it give results?


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PostPosted: Sun Jul 31, 2005 5:29 pm 
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Elephant
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it is good that you are training, but isolation work is very time consuming and i would say that doing heavier compound exercises would yeild better results.

maybe structure your three workouts like this. i am going to use random weights to use as an example:

1) bench day:

warmup, 10reps with 20kg bar

2nd warmup, 6reps with 40kg

then do two doubles at 72.5-75kg

then do 3singles at 80kg (this is assuming a bench max of 85kg)

cooldown with 20kg bar for 10reps

then do 10pullups

2) squat day:

warmup, 10reps with 20kg

2nd warmup, 6reps with 50kg

then do 2 doubles with 75kg

then do three singles with 85kg (assuming a squat max of 90-95kg)

cooldown with 20kg bar for 10reps

finally do 2sets of 6-8reps on mililtary press at 35kg (assuming 1rep max of 45kg)

3) deadlift

warmup 20kg bar 10 reps

2nd warmup 60kg 6reps

2doubles at 100kg

3singles at 120kg (assuming max of 130kg)

cooldown with 20kg bar for 10reps

finally, heavy curling with 35kg (assuming max of 45kg) for 2sets of 6.


after each of these workouts you will feel like you have been working for 45minutes (provided you work hard enough). you will add mass and strength far more effectively this way than by doing isolation work.

good luck

jonathan

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PostPosted: Sun Jul 31, 2005 7:05 pm 
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Elephant

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Compound exercises are generally used for those that are just starting out in the fitness realm, to condition their muscles and ligaments/tendons. After they progress, isolation is generally the next to do. And those three exercises are a weight-lifters regime, which is different from power-lifting, bodybuilding, etc. regime.


Also Gym Hater, what I didnt understand is that the topic says 45 minutes. Is it 15 or 45? Also, a 40 to 45 minute session in the gym is about the right amount of time to stay in the gym for.


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PostPosted: Sun Jul 31, 2005 7:21 pm 
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but that beginning period, even for bodybuilders should be 3-5years. isolation exercises are better for sculpting once you already have the mass, not for building it.

jonathan

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PostPosted: Mon Aug 01, 2005 3:43 am 
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Manatee
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Thanks for the advice. So if I understand correctly I need Compound training for mass and Isolation for definition?
I do not know what squads and deadlifts are, but I assume they are done with a fittness machine. The thing is that I don't go to the Gym, I just train at home with a bench press bench and some free weights. So I understand the bench press part, and I guess I can apply the 2 warming up sets and the cooling down to my other excersises.
It does look more time consuming though, but I will give it a try. I normaly just train 15 minutes at most when I train(15x3=45 minutes), but friends of mine who go to the gym train 1,5 hours per sesion(with less results than me). I also went to the gym a few years ago, but did not get any noticable results(even though training 1,5 hours per session). Also I do not like the waiting for the machines to become available, and I don't like the music in the gym.
Nowdays my approach to getting muscles was to just train as little as possible and rest as much as possible. I do not pay much attention to my diet, but since I got the advice to eat more protein I am trying to do that(currently eating some chocolate soy dessert). But I have also read somewhere that if you maintain the same training method your muscles become lazy, so now I will try the compound training.


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PostPosted: Mon Aug 01, 2005 3:54 am 
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Elephant

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Gym hater wrote:
Thanks for the advice. So if I understand correctly I need Compound training for mass and Isolation for definition?
I do not know what squads and deadlifts are, but I assume they are done with a fittness machine. The thing is that I don't go to the Gym, I just train at home with a bench press bench and some free weights. So I understand the bench press part, and I guess I can apply the 2 warming up sets and the cooling down to my other excersises.
It does look more time consuming though, but I will give it a try. I normaly just train 15 minutes at most when I train(15x3=45 minutes), but friends of mine who go to the gym train 1,5 hours per sesion(with less results than me). I also went to the gym a few years ago, but did not get any noticable results(even though training 1,5 hours per session). Also I do not like the waiting for the machines to become available, and I don't like the music in the gym.
Nowdays my approach to getting muscles was to just train as little as possible and rest as much as possible. I do not pay much attention to my diet, but since I got the advice to eat more protein I am trying to do that(currently eating some chocolate soy dessert). But I have also read somewhere that if you maintain the same training method your muscles become lazy, so now I will try the compound training.


That sounds a lot like HIT (High Intensity Training). Heres a listing of a lot of article on it:

http://www.bodybuilding.com/fun/bbinfo. ... ITPrograms

And heres a good article just to get an overview:

http://www.bodybuilding.com/fun/cyberpump8.htm

Basically, its like you stated, as less as possible. However one other thing to add into that is that everything is high intensity, and very little rest for as much time as you are in there.

As for the same training method, its called "plateauing". Basically your body gets used to the demands it takes, and therefore there are no more advancements. There are no gains or loss, it just stays there. The body needs to meet new demands in order to progress, which is the reason why you need to use more weight each time you workout (or second time) that bodypart (even if it is as little as 2.5 lbs).

As for the method of training, the same applies as well. If the sets, reps, exercises, etc. stay the same for a prolonged period, you will hit a plateau, or no state of advancement.

Basically what you should do is, every 2 to 3 weeks, change your schedule. Exercise, reps, sets, etc. like I said, change it all up.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Mon Aug 01, 2005 3:58 am 
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Elephant

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jonathan wrote:
but that beginning period, even for bodybuilders should be 3-5years. isolation exercises are better for sculpting once you already have the mass, not for building it.

jonathan


3 to 5 years of pure compound? Thats the first time I have heard of such a thing. Things are done in cycles. Macrocycles, Mesocycles, and Microcycles. In a cycle, you would dedicate it to tendons, ligaments, and base. The next you would continue to raise your limit strength (1 rep max). And the next one, you get specific for what sport you play, emulate the movements, etc.

However you are right that cycles are not necessarily weeks or months. However like I said, thats the first time i have heard of a 3 to 5 year beginning microcycle.


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PostPosted: Mon Aug 01, 2005 10:07 am 
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Elephant
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that is what it says in arnie's bodybuilding encyclopaedia. he started training when he was 15 and didnt start to focus on isolation stuff til he was 19. when you see pictures of him at 19 he looks really good - big, strong and not over defined.

gym hater - a squat is where you place the bar on your shoulders and squat down, like you are sitting on a chair, until your thighs reach parrellel to the floor. try to keep a straight back, your chest pushed forwards, your knees behind the line of your toes and your head up.

a deadlift is simply a weight on a barbell on the floor. you pick it up. there is no better exercise in my opinion.

for correct form just do a google search for 'correct form squat'. it should also come up with deadlift form tips too.
machines are generally crap, with the exception of calf raise machines. avoid the rest of them as they are the most impractical in terms of real life situations and strength. all they do is give you very specific strength to push a weight along a line. avoid machines by all costs!

jonathan

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Mon Aug 01, 2005 9:39 pm 
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Elephant

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jonathan wrote:
that is what it says in arnie's bodybuilding encyclopaedia. he started training when he was 15 and didnt start to focus on isolation stuff til he was 19. when you see pictures of him at 19 he looks really good - big, strong and not over defined.

gym hater - a squat is where you place the bar on your shoulders and squat down, like you are sitting on a chair, until your thighs reach parrellel to the floor. try to keep a straight back, your chest pushed forwards, your knees behind the line of your toes and your head up.

a deadlift is simply a weight on a barbell on the floor. you pick it up. there is no better exercise in my opinion.

for correct form just do a google search for 'correct form squat'. it should also come up with deadlift form tips too.
machines are generally crap, with the exception of calf raise machines. avoid the rest of them as they are the most impractical in terms of real life situations and strength. all they do is give you very specific strength to push a weight along a line. avoid machines by all costs!

jonathan


Thanks for helping Gymhater out, I forgot to answer that question as I was busy on the other.

Also, Arnie is different from everyone else. For example, not everyone is going towards the bodybuilder look like he was. For normal people like us lol, thats definitely far off (and i know you werent applying it to Gymhater or in general, but just thought Id clear that up). Theres the "Principle of Individual Differences" which states that everyone is different. You can't apply the same schedule you do, to someone else, since everyones body is different. Same goes with nutrition. You most likely knew that, since you are very knowledgable, but just thought I would explain it in more detail.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sun Aug 14, 2005 3:17 pm 
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Manatee
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Thanks for the help, I changed some things in my routine. The 15 minutes I train with weights I just change the weights a lot. Mostly I try heavier weights so I can do about six reps, but I also lower the weights sometimes so I can do about 15 reps. I still do just one set warming up and one set until failure, but I also added a cooling down set. And I am doing some light squatting with about 45 kg. I am not doing that to gain much mass, but just to get some definition. I also started to do a set of 50 push ups regularly.


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