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 Post subject: Krav Maga
PostPosted: Sun Jul 11, 2010 10:17 am 
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Manatee
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Location: Carbondale, CO
Anyone done any Krav Maga? I have been thinking of doing the Commando Krav Maga Instructor course. It is expensive, but once you are certified, there are no licensing or franchise fees. Anyone have any experience with them?

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 Post subject: Re: Krav Maga
PostPosted: Thu Jul 15, 2010 1:24 am 
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Gorilla
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STAY AWAY. STAY THE HELL AWAY.

I've been doing IKMF Krav Maga and love it. But the Commando Krav Maga stuff is total BS. The IKMF instructors generally spend years training before getting their teaching certificates. Commando Krav Maga is a money grab, plain and simple. The instructor course is what, 2 weeks? I got my P1 (practitioner level 1) in about 2 months, which was a record at our club. There are 5 Practitioner levels you have to pass (each more technical and stringent) before you can even take an instructor course or test for the instructor certificate. The head of Commando Krav Maga is known for running instructor courses in order to make money; the "krav" he teaches is watered down, impractical, and just plain doesn't work. I can't be against it any more passionately, lol. But seriously, CKM is the type of thing that will get someone killed. They spend a few months learning sloppy techniques from a guy who spent 2 weeks learning Krav (while assuming their instructor is an expert), and expect to be able to defend themselves. It's pretty much criminal.


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 Post subject: Re: Krav Maga
PostPosted: Thu Jul 15, 2010 4:54 am 
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What's wrong with plain judo or ju jutsu? Krav Maga is some excuse of a martial art.

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 Post subject: Re: Krav Maga
PostPosted: Thu Jul 15, 2010 6:00 am 
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Manatee
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Medman,

Yes, since my first post I have uncovered some interesting things on CKM. I have definitely ruled them out.

Duncan,

I spent years years learning Kung Fu and before that Tang Soo Do. Problem is you have to spend many years and a lot of training to become even a quasi decent practitioner. Very few of the techniques I have learned in either art would I ever use in defense. They involve too much movement and technique. And I have been in life threatening situations in my job that I have spent a lot more time perfecting technique then my self defense skills, and I will be the first too admit, your technique goes out the window. I know martial arts practitioners who admit the same thing. They spent years studying a variety of techniques, but when they needed to defend themselves, they stuck to a small handful of very basic techniques. Even in MMA you see a very limited number of techniques and those guys practice a lot more than most martial artists. Krav Maga is suppose to be more to the point and focus on basics instead of a lot of "technical" skill.

Also, I need to find schools that teach weekend boot camps because there is nothing in my area. At least nothing I have found in which I have an interest.

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 Post subject: Re: Krav Maga
PostPosted: Fri Jul 16, 2010 5:48 am 
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Indeed, Ducati, you are right. Practice and sparring are VERY important for martial arts. I cannot imagine a martial art without sparring. My main style is aikido and aikido is all practice, all sparring - well at least my school, where we train and don't talk :) Most aikido schools are all talk and little practice but that's another matter. There are almost no bad styles but usually the best ones are the original ones. Krav maga is just a judo inspired patchwork - better train judo or ju jutsu. The thing though is that you have to find a proper school (the very school). Ju jutsu is awesome but the judo schools, due to their sports nature, have more practice. This is a two-side coin because their very sports nature takes away from their practicality - too many rules. Anyway, judo fighters are still one of the best street fighters. So choose the most suitable for you style and then find a good school. Well you will most likely be limited by what's offered in your location. Of course, there are these styles which are hardcore fighting by their very nature - like kyokushin kai karate, although I am somehow not sure in the sanity of their methods (and heads for that matter).
Btw, having a good sparring partner is invaluable! My best friend and I used to spar each evening while we were students - wrestling, kicks, punches, combat in the open, combat in a small room - we tried everything. That was a tremendous help for me.
Like many people say, martial arts are one big family and the different styles are just a different approach.
The krav maga creators are good fighters because they are judo champions. Otherwise if a judo student and a krav maga student with relatively the same experience fight, I'd bet on the judo student:)

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 Post subject: Re: Krav Maga
PostPosted: Fri Jul 16, 2010 7:39 am 
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Duncan,

I haven't found any sparing partners here. Most of the martial arts schools I have looked into have a large number of kids, and very few if any adults. And the instructors all yell a lot like you are in the military.

I really love Kung Fu because it teaches so many things. But it is too technical. Too precise. You have to really train like a monk, spending day in and day out developing those skills to become proficient at defense. I know over 25 forms, but out of them, the only things I would use to defend myself is maybe 5 or six moves. We also have 30 releases that are quite useful though.

When I train purely for self defense, I focus on knees and elbows, open hand strikes, low kicks, grappling, arm and wrist breaks, and soft spots. Things that are simple and most effective without a lot of extra motion. I figure if someone has to think about a move, its too late to use it.

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 Post subject: Re: Krav Maga
PostPosted: Fri Jul 16, 2010 12:26 pm 
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Duncan_Idaho, I disagree with your description of Krav Maga as "just a judo inspired patchwork". It has some things in common, but the unique part of Krav (IKMF krav, not the bogus commando strip mall kind) is that every move is simple, and builds on your natural reflexes. Nearly every technique is taught in the context of fighting multiple opponents as well - because that's what is most likely to be encountered. Every technique is also taught in the context of wanting to turn around and run away as soon as the attacker is disabled/stunned enough for you to be able to run without being chased.

I do agree about the good sparring partner though. Krav doesn't involve a tremendous amount of traditional sparring, because it's so focused on getting away from the fight - but what you do need is someone who puts in realistic effort. Like when you practice the defense from someone choking you from behind...you need a partner who is actually choking you, not giving your neck a gentle massage ;).


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 Post subject: Re: Krav Maga
PostPosted: Sat Jul 17, 2010 5:35 pm 
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Manatee
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medman wrote:
Duncan_Idaho, I disagree with your description of Krav Maga as "just a judo inspired patchwork".

Since I don't have really deep impressions from Krav Maga, I decided to watch a youtube video of it. I randomly watched Roy Elghanyan (no idea who he is or which branch of Krav Maga that is) but all of the grips/chokes/throws were Aikido/Ju Jutsu techniques. The guy looks pretty good too...in ju jutsu/aikido :P. That's modified Japanese techniques. No Zan Shin but it would be hard to keep Zan Shin and aim to escape anyway. Or maybe this was the commando thing?

Ducati, from the way you described your idea about a self defense style, I'd recommend Muai Thai - it's a nice, tough style, which uses kicks, knees, elbows, etc. Still, the best street fighters I've seen are the judo fighters.

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 Post subject: Re: Krav Maga
PostPosted: Sat Jul 17, 2010 6:03 pm 
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Duncan_Idaho wrote:
medman wrote:
Duncan_Idaho, I disagree with your description of Krav Maga as "just a judo inspired patchwork".

Since I don't have really deep impressions from Krav Maga, I decided to watch a youtube video of it. I randomly watched Roy Elghanyan (no idea who he is or which branch of Krav Maga that is) but all of the grips/chokes/throws were Aikido/Ju Jutsu techniques. The guy looks pretty good too...in ju jutsu/aikido :P. That's modified Japanese techniques. No Zan Shin but it would be hard to keep Zan Shin and aim to escape anyway. Or maybe this was the commando thing?

Ducati, from the way you described your idea about a self defense style, I'd recommend Muai Thai - it's a nice, tough style, which uses kicks, knees, elbows, etc. Still, the best street fighters I've seen are the judo fighters.



Duncan,

Krav Maga actually gets a lot of strikes from Muay Thai, and as you mentioned, Judo lineage as well. But, I don't have any of those options in my area. I might look into a different Kung Fu school and see what they offer.

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 Post subject: Re: Krav Maga
PostPosted: Sat Jul 17, 2010 6:22 pm 
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I wish I had done Western wrestling when I was younger. Some form of catch-as-catch-can, perhaps. To me, that seems like the most effective form of grappling in normal real life situations.

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 Post subject: Re: Krav Maga
PostPosted: Thu Oct 20, 2011 12:54 pm 
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How do you find out which studios teach commando and which teach worthwhile Krav Maga?
There is a studio near my house, but nothing on their website mentions which kind of KM it is. One instructor is a KMA Force Civilian Law Enforcement Instructor, Cross Fit Instructor, and 4th Degree Black Belt in Tae Kwon Do with over 20 years martial arts exp. All of the other instructors are people with fitness backgrounds, and some are certified personal trainers.
The studio offers a free class. Should I bite? What questions should I ask?
http://krav.pro/instructors

Thanks!

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 Post subject: Re: Krav Maga
PostPosted: Mon Oct 31, 2011 2:16 am 
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If you want something functional take a look at keysi.

I've studied various martial arts but Keysi will turn you into a scrapper :)

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 Post subject: Re: Krav Maga
PostPosted: Mon Oct 31, 2011 2:17 am 
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Ps link on my signature

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 Post subject: Re: Krav Maga
PostPosted: Fri Jan 06, 2012 1:33 am 
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Duncan_Idaho wrote:
What's wrong with plain judo or ju jutsu? Krav Maga is some excuse of a martial art.


First off anyone who said or told you Krav is a martial art it isnt. Its a fighting defense. I trained it for years and there is no formality in it at all. There's no kata's, form's or any bs like that. Maybe keys to the temples, thumbs in the eyes, and deep heels to the groin...
I trained BJJ for a while before and when I told them I was training KM I always got 'that stuff is crazy'
I trained out of the National Training center and as for the commando thing never heard of it. Any one persuing fitness and being able to protect themselves is more then reasonable, and good on them. Bastardizing true Krav IMO is cool as long as people arent making it cheesy.

Krav is not for the light hearted and I know 100lb women who do it, I hope no guy is dumb enough to step to them :boxer:


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