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 Post subject: Re: My little experiment...
PostPosted: Tue Aug 24, 2010 9:50 am 
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Each person has a different motivation and different levels of what they are prepared to do, or go without, regarding veganism. I do not think it is worth arguing over such things, because it is a fundamental difference in what is ethical and / or worthwhile / practical. Those core things are what separate us, and I don't see a way to overcome that, apart from individuals coming to a different conclusion over time after giving it deep thought. It's not the sort of thing that gets sorted out on a forum, no matter how long the debate might become.

Personally, I am happy to tell people I won't eat their food if I consider it not to be vegan. I will eat food that has been made in a place that handles dairy products and so on, though I won't eat something if it has non-vegan ingredients. That's my cut off point, and I understand other people's view point on the subject. I don't think it is wise to be negative towards people for doing what they think is right, especially if their actions have no negative impact as a result, just because you consider it a waste of time / effort / unnecessary, others feel differently

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 Post subject: Re: My little experiment...
PostPosted: Wed Aug 25, 2010 1:22 am 
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I agree, Richard!

Cold, do you have a filter installed in your brain which transforms all your thoughts into Earth Crisis-style tough-guy-talk? It is not cool, it's hilarious. No offence, just sayin' ;)

Also, I think it's about time we stopped trashing this thread and discuss vegan righteousness via PM's or e-mail.

Peace!

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 Post subject: Re: My little experiment...
PostPosted: Sat Sep 18, 2010 11:19 am 
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Hey 2097!

I agree most of your comment and want to thank you for taking time!

Yes I was a f**kin' diet hopper but how I said I am on the right track now with high carbs and low pro/fat, like you said my diet should be.

Another point is, I strongly believe that people are very different, and my or your diet doesn't work for everyone, see Berkhan and Co. (or his tons of clients! That should be prove enough.).

I believe in the theory of metabolic typing. Of protein types, carb types and mixed types.

I did a test of the old school Dr. Kelly, and the result is phenomenal! I am a type 4, meaning not a strict vegetarian type (few eggs, dairy and fish per week) and since I started this I have energy I've never experienced before. My mood what is usually bad are happy and elevated most of the time. I am more satisfied with my meals and do not tend to overeat anymore like I did so many times... okay enough talk, I found what I searched for :D

See ya and recommending you do it too. Didn't you asked yourself why a few (or much) vegans/vegetarians feeling like crap on their diet? Because they are protein or mixed types. The same for meat eaters that should be veg eaters ;)

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 Post subject: Re: My little experiment...
PostPosted: Sat Sep 18, 2010 12:51 pm 
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Vegeta if someday you wanna try again high-protein low carb diet, try drinking just hemp protein powder with water or make some shakes with one fruit and soy milk. Just protein drinks and eating raw vegetables will be high protein low-carb without the need to eat meat, eggs, etc. If you want it high-fat also you can put olive oil on the raw vegetables or add coconut oil in the smoothies. Coconut oil is kind of like butter, because solid in the fridge but liquid when heated, high in saturated fats. Delicious for desserts or smoothies because it tastes coconut.

But it is much better to eat high-card diet, much more energy.

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 Post subject: Re: My little experiment...
PostPosted: Mon Sep 20, 2010 1:59 pm 
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I don't eat fish, dairy eggs 'cause of the complete protein dilemma, I just eat it when I feel that I have to eat it, when I feel my body needs it.
It's not much, but it's there, this would make me maybe a 88% per cent vegan if you want.

I could say you too are labeling yourself with vegan ;) The labeling is just a help.

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 Post subject: Re: My little experiment...
PostPosted: Thu Sep 23, 2010 10:25 am 
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2097 wrote:
I'm not a Vegan; I'm eating how humans are meant to eat. Chickens/turkeys are for dogs to eat because if you put a chicken with a dog; the only thing the dog will want to do is kill and eat it. Cows/pigs are for panthers/lions to eat. Then we wonder why tigers are going extinct...humans are eating their food and hunting them for their fur.

When you feel your body needs it....your body is addicted to it. Your mind is KING...your body is the KINGDOM. Thats why when someone has a sugar craving; its the organs that are addicted to it and send signals to the brain, begging for sugar.

You should watch "what the bleep do we know". Amazing movie that explains how thoughts control how your body functions.


Exactly !
This reminds me of Vipassana meditation, I learned to feel those subtle body sensations of cravings. The mind is often a slave of the exterior environment because of how the body history of the past interprets each thing that we see, ear, taste, linked with how we dealed with those things thoughout our life, we are conditioned, brainwashed to always react the same way to those stimuli. With a calm and clear mind one can remain equanimous instead of reacting to cravings and aversions.

It's like those guys on the Primal Diet that I talked to, many say they tried a vegan diet but they say they felt weak (because not enough calories usually) and their "body was screaming for beef and cream" and that they had to listen to their body needs. Yeah right ! How could the body possibly needs something that does not exist in nature, something such as cream and butter ? These things weren't even part of the Primal Diet, which was perhaps much higher than we think in seeds, nuts, fruits, root vegetables and sprouts.

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 Post subject: Re: My little experiment...
PostPosted: Thu Sep 23, 2010 10:29 am 
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I find it funny that on some pro-meat anti-vegan website by a stupid doctor, he was saying humans are not pigeons therefore our natural diet is not grains. As if we were tigers and lions... Then he compared the picture of a gorilla next to a man, saying there were many differencies... Not really, no. Of course he didn't compared the anatomy of lion with human.

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 Post subject: Re: My little experiment...
PostPosted: Sat Sep 25, 2010 11:44 pm 
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VEGETA wrote:
I believe in the theory of metabolic typing. Of protein types, carb types and mixed types.

I don't believe this is based on any real science and is just a money maker for Mercola and others: http://www.vegsource.com/news/2010/09/d ... esman.html


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 Post subject: Re: My little experiment...
PostPosted: Sun Sep 26, 2010 10:19 am 
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@mjzraz I don't think so.

Look at Mingers post on the china study. Of course the site you posted vegsource will always show article that are against animal products. Same for Mingers critique on there.
And Mercola is not the inventor of metabolic typing, Dr. Kelley does this years before (in the 70s) then came walcott, mercola and so on.
And Campell didn't do the work he just collected results of studies and left much results in the background. Read Minger.
She is the neutral one, read her story, she too tried all "diets".

And by the way, why it have to be based on real science if it works?? You wrote that like you would believe in the words what your doctor would say. I don't believe in mainstream science especially what I do is believing in what I feel on certain foods and the experience I make with myself and of the experience of others.

For one is a meat diet the right thing and for others the green "meat" diet (and for others a mixed one). Saw so many prooves!

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 Post subject: Re: My little experiment...
PostPosted: Sun Sep 26, 2010 12:17 pm 
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VEGETA wrote:
I believe in the theory of metabolic typing. Of protein types, carb types and mixed types.
For one is a meat diet the right thing and for others the green "meat" diet (and for others a mixed one). Saw so many prooves!


Why would human be the only species that need a different diet for each individual ? Other animals don't try low-fat or high protein or low-carb diets, they just stick to their natural diet. All lions eat the same diet, all elephants eat the same, et cetera. There is only one optimal diet for each species. Because we have the same organs, same anantomy. Just the size that differs from an individual to another, and other small differencies, but we all function the same. If someone is more active or has a larger frame: need more calories, not really a bigger ratio of carbs or proteins or fat.

I say this but I do agree to some degree that some changes may exist in the diet to adapt for each person... but not huge extreme changes like zero carbs for one person and almost only carbs for another person. For example: a very yin person needs more yang food. Or a Vata person, who's light frame and high in the elements of Air and Ether, needs to eat heavier meals, to be more grounded. Opposites heal. An heavy kapha will eat light meals. Pittas with Fire need raw rood especially during pitta Summer season. But overall, we all need to tend towards a more Sattvic lifestyle and satvic nutrition.

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 Post subject: Re: My little experiment...
PostPosted: Mon Sep 27, 2010 5:25 am 
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Yes, because we are not animals in their sense. We evolved from Africa and other continents. In upper regions there was a cold region, where no green vegetation grew, downwards there was more green and so on. People mixed up together. New gen pools and so on..

Yes, you can see metabolic typing like the Ayuverdic diet, it's quite similar.

For example, I don't think that people ate tons of nuts like today, because it was difficult to find them and to crack them, maybe occasionally but not in large quantities, the same for grains, they don't waited until it grew up and was ready to eat, they would be dead, they had to eat some animals flesh or products like eggs. It depended where the people lived too.

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 Post subject: Re: My little experiment...
PostPosted: Mon Sep 27, 2010 9:00 am 
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The current Wrestler from India who won the Gold in World Wrestling Championships... is lacto-Vegetarian. Gets Almonds+Milk drink from his family village cows. A lot of old strong men used to drink litres of milk... So does this guy.

I know there's a lot of Anti-milk debate here.. but if you take it from the largest VEG population on the planet.. in India.. milk has been a staple. It might help pack on those pounds. Then again... Milk is crappy in the US.. due to factory farming.. unless you for Grass-fed / Organic / Not super processed via pasteurization.

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 Post subject: Re: My little experiment...
PostPosted: Mon Sep 27, 2010 9:05 am 
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Location: TX+CA > Migrated > India
Cold Fission wrote:
jcdenton wrote:
Marcina wrote:
My family used to be afraid to make food for me because of how strict I was.. So I can see Vegeta's point. I'm not a vegan anymore, but even as a vegan, I never called myself one because people would react negatively.. Not only that but I felt like a hypocrite calling myself "vegan" when I would knowingly use items containing animal products such as riding my motorcycle with a leather seat ya know? Or electricity which kills thousands of animals a year.

So, if I'm at a family BBQ, and I eat my veggie burger on a bun containing a little whey powder, I'm not going to flip out.

I will say one thing about the company I work for though. Not only did they bring in vegan burger patties for me at the company BBQ, but they also brought in a second grill to cook it on that was seperate from the beef burgers. I was so impressed and honoured they went through all that trouble for me. It was so sweet I almost cried! Lol!


Sometimes I also eat stuff with trace amounts of whey, eggs or other animal products in it - does that make me a vegetarian? I just don't see any point in obsessing over such miniscule things. Those ingredients are simply by-products of animal agriculture which would go away together with the industry. As I see it, trying to avoiding such ingredients 100% of the time doesn't do anything to change the situation, so I don't bother. Besides, as I've mentioned above, it is, after all, impossible. We would even have to give up books as they're usually bound with animal-derived glue. You can't make perfect decisions in an imperfect world.

To me, veganism isn't about purity or following rigid rules, but, rather, about minimizing animal abuse. And there's more to it than just doing this and not doing that.

Riding on a leather seat is pretty lame, though :D

Refusing animal products all together is the way to get companies to only make vegan options.

And i would not eat a product of torture.

Take more pride in yourselves and you beliefs.


If markets would only SHIFT this way.. They dont. People do things for themselves.. not JUST FOR animals. Most people here are doing that... the add-on is that you are not eating animals.

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Does burning food to raise water temperature equate to energy utilization by DIGESTING food (chewing, saliva, stomach acid, pancreatic enzymes, liver etc. Intestines:nutrients absorbed into blood stream)? Definitely NOT! Do Calories really mean anything?


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 Post subject: Re: My little experiment...
PostPosted: Mon Sep 27, 2010 9:14 am 
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Joined: Mon Mar 20, 2006 8:51 pm
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Location: TX+CA > Migrated > India
VEGETA wrote:
Yes, because we are not animals in their sense. We evolved from Africa and other continents. In upper regions there was a cold region, where no green vegetation grew, downwards there was more green and so on. People mixed up together. New gen pools and so on..

Yes, you can see metabolic typing like the Ayuverdic diet, it's quite similar.

For example, I don't think that people ate tons of nuts like today, because it was difficult to find them and to crack them, maybe occasionally but not in large quantities, the same for grains, they don't waited until it grew up and was ready to eat, they would be dead, they had to eat some animals flesh or products like eggs. It depended where the people lived too.


Ayurveda talks about Pros & Cons of meat/fish/eggs. Mostly the Pros are outweighed by the Cons.

Also talks about Cow Milk & Ashwagandha as "Guru" for growth. Also, recommends Cow Urine for lots of benefits.

Ayurveda fundamentals are so brilliant that once you understand them you can see why each & every so called DIET (fat diets..) worked / works for various people... from the angle they are looking. Not meaning that FAD diet is the best but HOW it works.

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Does burning food to raise water temperature equate to energy utilization by DIGESTING food (chewing, saliva, stomach acid, pancreatic enzymes, liver etc. Intestines:nutrients absorbed into blood stream)? Definitely NOT! Do Calories really mean anything?


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 Post subject: Re: My little experiment...
PostPosted: Mon Sep 27, 2010 10:02 am 
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crashnburn wrote:
The current Wrestler from India who won the Gold in World Wrestling Championships... is lacto-Vegetarian. Gets Almonds+Milk drink from his family village cows. A lot of old strong men used to drink litres of milk... So does this guy.

I know there's a lot of Anti-milk debate here.. but if you take it from the largest VEG population on the planet.. in India.. milk has been a staple. It might help pack on those pounds. Then again... Milk is crappy in the US.. due to factory farming.. unless you for Grass-fed / Organic / Not super processed via pasteurization.


Fully agree, in India the cow is holy. As I was on the 100% vegan trip there was something missing, I always was hungry, though I couldn't eat the quantities of beans I have made for myself and stuffed full until my throat I still felt a hunger feeling. With a little fish/eggs/cheese it left.

Hey crashnburn, I see in your profiel that you migrated to India, what was the reason and how many years you are living there?
What are you doin' sounds very interesting to me! :D

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