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 Post subject: Some pharmacists refusing to fill birth control
PostPosted: Sun Nov 06, 2005 5:02 pm 
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Gorilla
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http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/articles/A5490-2005Mar27.html

snip...

Some pharmacists across the country are refusing to fill prescriptions for birth control and morning-after pills, saying that dispensing the medications violates their personal moral or religious beliefs.

The trend has opened a new front in the nation's battle over reproductive rights, sparking an intense debate over the competing rights of pharmacists to refuse to participate in something they consider repugnant and a woman's right to get medications her doctor has prescribed. It has also triggered pitched political battles in statehouses across the nation as politicians seek to pass laws either to protect pharmacists from being penalized -- or force them to carry out their duties.

===

Should these pharmacists be allowed to make decisions based on their personal morality that affect OUR health? Doesn't this basically give them the right to supercede what our doctors have prescribed? If we allow them to make these types of decisions, where will it end? Will it become acceptable, at some point in time, to force pregnant vegans to eat dairy/meat to assure a healthy baby. (We all know how many people think a vegan diet isn't healthy. "Where do you get your protein?")

BTW, are said pharmacists also refusing to fill Viagra perscritpions for single men? No, of course they aren't.

As a vegan, if I work in a restaurant or grocery store, would I be allowed to refuse to serve/sell meat or would my employer tell me, "That's part of the job. If you have an issue, there's the door." We all know the answer to that.

Regardless of your view of birth control/morning after pills, we are all standing on the proverbial slippery slope with this issue.

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Thu Nov 10, 2005 12:09 am 
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Rabbit

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I completley agree with what you have stated, If they don't want to fill the prescription then they should not be in the job.
It disgusts me how the far right have permiated every part of our society.
Karen


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Thu Nov 10, 2005 1:56 am 
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Elephant
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brit wrote:
I completley agree with what you have stated, If they don't want to fill the prescription then they should not be in the job.
It disgusts me how the far right have permiated every part of our society.
Karen


I concur that they shouldnt be in the job then.

sidenote: I do not agree with birth control.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Thu Nov 10, 2005 2:07 am 
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Gorilla

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*deep breaths, deep breaths*

As either of my roommates can tell you, I get IRATE when it comes to reproductive issues, pharmacy, the FDA....one only needs to venture over to my MySpace blogs to see what I'm talking about...I'm constantly ranting about these very things.

I cannot imagine a job where one can refuse to do the perfectly legal demands of the work. F#$&(*$ing ridiculous. I forget what they're called....conscience clauses or something like that? That states are enacting to let pharmacists off the hook for this behavior? Birth control pills and emergency contraception are vitally important drugs! And if the right wants to prevent abortions, I think they ought to be passing them out as quickly as possible, not PREVENT access to them!!!!!!

:evil: :evil: :evil: :evil: I get SO angry!!!!

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PostPosted: Thu Nov 10, 2005 10:14 am 
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Elephant
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Hero wrote:
sidenote: I do not agree with birth control.

Why not?

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Thu Nov 10, 2005 10:18 am 
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Elephant
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Hero wrote:
sidenote: I do not agree with birth control.


If you had a uterus I suspect you would.

I know you are all for abstinence, which is definately a good form of birth control. (Works for me) But what about for example, my cousin who is married but not ready for kids. Or other people in long term relationships...food for thought.

I hate the argument that birth control is a form of abortion. It's retarded. It's like veggymeggy said, birth control prevents abortions.

Those pharmacists don't have any right to deny the pills because of their beliefs. Its like crispyQ said, if we refused to serve people or sell people meet because of our beliefs we would be out of a job.

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Thu Nov 10, 2005 12:48 pm 
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Elephant

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http://www.vegansociety.com/html/people/health/contraceptives.php


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Thu Nov 10, 2005 2:19 pm 
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Elephant

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Quote:
I hate the argument that birth control is a form of abortion. It's retarded. It's like veggymeggy said, birth control prevents abortions.


Probably depends on your definition of abortion and your understanding of when life begins... no?


*rethinking this*

Wondering if Toph meant it in the more Catholic-esque sense... like anything that's done sexually without conception as a goal - use of pills or barriers, masturbation... etc.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Thu Nov 10, 2005 2:24 pm 
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Gorilla

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SeaSiren wrote:

Interesting link, I'd never given consideration to birth control's veganism!
I personally use(when I can afford it :() hormonal birth control but NOT oral, so it's not listed. I am curious now however.

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Thu Nov 10, 2005 2:30 pm 
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Gorilla

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Aaron wrote:
Quote:
I hate the argument that birth control is a form of abortion. It's retarded. It's like veggymeggy said, birth control prevents abortions.


Probably depends on your definition of abortion and your understanding of when life begins... no?


No. That's a misunderstanding of how hormonal birth control functions.
It is designed to prevent the fertilization of an egg by suppressing ovulation, NOT by preventing implantation of a fertilized egg.

Read: "How do birth controls with artificial hormones work?
Hormonal forms of birth control contain artificial estrogen and/or progestin to mimic the hormones your body produces. Your body then responds to these increased levels of hormones in different ways, all of which can prevent a pregnancy. The main way in which these forms of contraception are designed to work is by suppressing ovulation. The extra hormones also work to thicken your cervical mucus thereby creating a hostile environment for sperm. Both of these methods help to prevent fertilization. " (http://www.epigee.org/guide/medfaq.html#hormones)

If you read on, there is some debate over if the primary means of preventing pregnancy fail and an egg does become fertilized, if 'the pill' or what have you then prevents implantation...it is however a completely undecided topic, and really the source of more political debate than scientific.

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Thu Nov 10, 2005 2:36 pm 
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Elephant
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Aaron wrote:
Wondering if Toph meant it in the more Catholic-esque sense... like anything that's done sexually without conception as a goal - use of pills or barriers, masturbation... etc.

Yeah, that's the only reason I can see to oppose birth control... holding the belief that one should never engage in a sex act if it can't result in procreation. But I'm curious about what his reason actually is.

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Thu Nov 10, 2005 6:41 pm 
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Elephant
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I cant explain this and dont feel like it. sorry. its too emotional for me


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Thu Nov 10, 2005 6:49 pm 
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Elephant
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So you are against because of some personal experience and not because of some particular belief or ideology?

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Thu Nov 10, 2005 7:48 pm 
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Elephant

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Location: Portland, OR
VegMeg from your link:

Quote:
If the other two methods fail and an egg were to be fertilized, then the Pill may work to thin the uterine lining thereby blocking the implantation of a fertilized egg. However, ther eis some debate as to just how often this occurs.


So it occurs. Or may reasonably be understood to potentially occur. We're certainly not sure it doesn't.

And if you insist life starts at conception then this fact that it may possibly occur and that the situation where it occurs is one where someone has actively chosen to take the pill and mostly likely actively chose to have sex - the whole thing might look to you like a person creating that potential within themselves for the pill to act as an abortificant which probably strikes you as a moral injustice. Right?

I recognize that's not the intent of the pill taker or the intended function etc. I'm just saying it creates the potential, potentially. Which for some may well be too much.

The link didn't mention politics in that section... I don't think? I'm going to guess you've got another link that does? I'd be interested to read more on how political it is :)

Meanwhile -

FormLino: I think if you understand life to begin before implantation and have the understanding that hormonal BC causes an inhospitable environment I think that one may not necesarrily have to ride the Catholic esque belief pony. Although that segment of society is probably not well populated :) AND! Vegspace! Omg I had no idea it existed! Awesome :D


Last edited by Aaron on Thu Nov 10, 2005 7:57 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Thu Nov 10, 2005 7:53 pm 
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Rabbit

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OMG!!! That enfuriates me so much for personal reasons! If you don't agree with something don't do it or get involved, but don't inerfere with others. Besides our population would be much higher if we didn't have the pills.

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