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 Post subject: Any vegans who lapsed and returned...?
PostPosted: Wed Feb 29, 2012 9:12 am 
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Rabbit
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Just curious if their are any long term vegans here who started eating meat again for whatever reason and then went back to being vegan for whatever reason... I post at a non-vegan body building website as well. Every once in a while a vegan diet thread comes up. People always chime in with stories about how they were vegan for 5 years, started eating meat again, and felt much better. Maybe some were lacking nutrients or maybe it is all mental but makes me wonder. Seems like a lot of people become vegan thinking it is an easy sure fire way to lose weight. It is harder to cut up on a vegan diet, especially in body building. I have been vegan since 2004, veggie since 1994. It was my attempt to be as healthy as I possibly could be, and I am healthier. But lately I question that there is not a healthier way. Sure would be simple to hit macros with some flesh thrown in! Talk me off the ledge...


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 Post subject: Re: Re: Any vegans who lapsed and returned...?
PostPosted: Wed Feb 29, 2012 9:31 am 
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Manatee
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Grape Nuts wrote:
[...] People always chime in with stories about how they were vegan for 5 years, started eating meat again, and felt much better. [...] Seems like a lot of people become vegan thinking it is an easy sure fire way to lose weight. [...] Talk me off the ledge...


I've been Vegan for 13 years & never went back, so I can't say much there. I don't regret it one bit, and quite the opposite, I feel spiritually/mentally better for it everyday. Physically, I didn't exactly notice a change, but I'm convinced it is because I'm a health freak too. *I* did my homework before going Vegan, I read up on health related issues regularly. I didn't watch oprah & just cut meat/eggs/dairy out lol like I can only imagine many have.

Beyond not getting all your nutrients, a few things that might be relevant to supposed Vegans (there is a difference between being Vegan and just following a plant-based diet) suddenly feeling better when they quit are blood type & food sensitivities. A good chunk of people are type O, and if anyone feels better eating meat it is them. However, with that being said, that doesn't mean they HAVE to. In fact, I believe there was a website (might still be) for blood type O Veg/ans lol. If people would focus on eating many foods that are highly beneficial for them, it might make all the difference, and they don't have to quit being Vegan.

Keeping a log for over a month of your foods & if you feel bad, with the times they occur, can really help pinpoint sensitivities. It could also be that they have a gluten intolerance (iirc, type O's should avoid wheat), yet that's all they ate while their diet was plant-based. I'm very hesitant when I get asked what I eat as a Vegan; we're all so different that everyone's Vegan menu will be unique to them.

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 Post subject: Re: Any vegans who lapsed and returned...?
PostPosted: Wed Feb 29, 2012 9:54 am 
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Rabbit
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Thanks for reply. That is some of the most interesting advice I have heard on this forum. Never heard of type "O" issues, which I am... Will look into it. Yes I keep a log and I feel really good. My wife has several intolerances which I am finally getting sorted out through detailed record keeping. We both quit wheat with great results. I am not a spiritual person, I eat vegan entirely for selfish, health reasons. I am finding it really hard to get below 10% BF, hovering between 12-12.5%, can't help but wonder if a shift in macros (meat) would make it easier. You don't see many sub 10% vegans around here, especially that maintain it. Seems to be the exception, not the rule. I once would have thought otherwise.
Thanks again, will look into type O
Ron


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 Post subject: Re: Re: Any vegans who lapsed and returned...?
PostPosted: Wed Feb 29, 2012 10:23 am 
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Manatee
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Grape Nuts wrote:
Thanks for reply. That is some of the most interesting advice I have heard on this forum. Never heard of type "O" issues, which I am... Will look into it. Yes I keep a log and I feel really good. My wife has several intolerances which I am finally getting sorted out through detailed record keeping. We both quit wheat with great results. I am not a spiritual person, I eat vegan entirely for selfish, health reasons. I am finding it really hard to get below 10% BF, hovering between 12-12.5%, can't help but wonder if a shift in macros (meat) would make it easier. You don't see many sub 10% vegans around here, especially that maintain it. Seems to be the exception, not the rule. I once would have thought otherwise.
Thanks again, will look into type O
Ron

You're so very welcome & I'm glad you thought so. I'm type A and cutting out several avoid items (tomatoes, vinegar, black olives, potatoes) that I indulged in for years helped wonders with my stomach pain. I can eat them again here and there, but no way will I go back to that pain lol. I consider the blood type diet a suggestion, not a hard rule, which is how the author of the book presents it. Sadly, many type O's, like my father, cling to it fiercely as a reason not to go Vegan... still doesn't justify the leather or cosmetics tested on animals dad :p

Anyways. As for the body fat, I am new to bodybuilding so I can't help you there :/

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 Post subject: Re: Any vegans who lapsed and returned...?
PostPosted: Wed Feb 29, 2012 1:16 pm 
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Yeah did it for almost two years first year of college, got lazy/stupid. back 5 years later...

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 Post subject: Re: Any vegans who lapsed and returned...?
PostPosted: Wed Feb 29, 2012 2:43 pm 
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Grape Nuts wrote:
Thanks for reply. That is some of the most interesting advice I have heard on this forum. Never heard of type "O" issues, which I am... Will look into it.

Don't bother. Blood type dieting is nonsense. There's no evidence for it whatsoever. There are zero peer reviewed articles on it in PubMed. Zero. None. D'Adamo hasn't even produced results from the clinical trials he claims to be running. Real, published, verified research has shown that lectins in foods are not ABO-specific.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Blood_type_diet

You're only limiting yourself if you take it into account with your own diet. Figure out what's best for you personally based on how you feel.

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 Post subject: Re: Re: Any vegans who lapsed and returned...?
PostPosted: Wed Feb 29, 2012 4:57 pm 
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blabbate wrote:
Don't bother. Blood type dieting is nonsense.

Yea, I guess I was totally making up my stomach pains, or any other benefit from following some of the advice. And FYI, I didn't (nor does the author) say to follow it to the letter.

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 Post subject: Re: Re: Any vegans who lapsed and returned...?
PostPosted: Wed Feb 29, 2012 4:58 pm 
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blabbate wrote:
Don't bother. Blood type dieting is nonsense.

Yea, I guess I was totally making up my stomach pains, or any other benefit from following some of the advice. And FYI, I didn't (nor does the author) say to follow it to the letter.

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 Post subject: Re: Any vegans who lapsed and returned...?
PostPosted: Wed Feb 29, 2012 6:06 pm 
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Joined: Wed Feb 29, 2012 5:22 pm
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I did on purpose after years of being Vegan. I wanted to see if meat would rot in my intestines and it did. :( :( :( Gas issues plus pooping a rock the next morning. :cry:

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 Post subject: Re: Any vegans who lapsed and returned...?
PostPosted: Wed Feb 29, 2012 6:21 pm 
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Rabbit
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Haha you guys are funny! Some of the type "O" stuff suits me well, like not eating grains or oats. Have not had a headache in 6 months or so since I stopped. Didn't stop for that reason, but that is the result I got. Also I was raised hunting since birth. I used to love game animal meat, which says type O should eat. I seriously don't see myself ever eating meat again. But I look around and see how easy the meat eating body builders can bulk and cut, and it makes one wonder... I think I will try kicking up the spirulina/chlorella intake to around 25g each per day spread out in 5 doses for a week. A space-food diet has always intrigued me...


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 Post subject: Re: Any vegans who lapsed and returned...?
PostPosted: Wed Feb 29, 2012 9:22 pm 
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I was Vegetarian first and waxed and waned between Vegetarianism and Veganism for a month or two, then when Vegan totally. Haven't looked back since.

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 Post subject: Re: Re: Any vegans who lapsed and returned...?
PostPosted: Thu Mar 01, 2012 9:00 am 
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Mina wrote:
blabbate wrote:
Don't bother. Blood type dieting is nonsense.

Yea, I guess I was totally making up my stomach pains, or any other benefit from following some of the advice. And FYI, I didn't (nor does the author) say to follow it to the letter.

Correlation doesn't equal causation, and anecdotal evidence isn't proof. Your benefits could have been from any number of other factors that have nothing to do with blood type. They could have been simple regression to the mean. They could have been placebo. This is why we do controlled studies.

We can't say for sure exactly what caused the effects, but we can say with a high degree of confidence based on actual research that D'Adamo's claims that lectins in food react differently with different blood types are utterly false.

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 Post subject: Re: Re: Re: Any vegans who lapsed and returned...?
PostPosted: Thu Mar 01, 2012 9:19 am 
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Wow blabbate, you insult me twice, and share no sources.

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 Post subject: Re: Re: Re: Any vegans who lapsed and returned...?
PostPosted: Thu Mar 01, 2012 10:08 am 
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Gorilla

Joined: Mon Oct 06, 2008 11:58 am
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Mina wrote:
Wow blabbate, you insult me twice, and share no sources.

This isn't supposed to be insulting. I'm not saying anything personal. These are just facts.

There are plenty of sources in the References section of the wikipedia article I posted a link to.

Here are a few:
http://web.archive.org/web/201105151232 ... et/AN01415
http://web.archive.org/web/201008040340 ... _1049.html
http://www.vegsource.com/articles/blood_hype.htm - I'm not usually a huge fan of vegsource, but this particular article is pretty well-researched and referenced.
http://skepdic.com/bloodtypediet.html - The Skeptics Dictionary page links to references for each of its claims.

And Dr. Pusztai gets a special mention, because he's particularly thorough:
http://www.owenfoundation.com/Health_Sc ... t_FAQ.html

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 Post subject: Re: Any vegans who lapsed and returned...?
PostPosted: Sat Mar 03, 2012 10:46 am 
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Rabbit

Joined: Mon Dec 28, 2009 4:07 pm
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I was vegetarian during some of my teenager years. Then I started eating meat again. Made me fatter and I didn't feel better.

I'm now back to a plant based diet since a while and I feel better - both physically and mentally.


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