Dr.McDougall -- The Starch Solution

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HorseSense
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Re: Dr.McDougall -- The Starch Solution

#16 Postby HorseSense » Wed Jul 04, 2012 6:42 am

Well sounds like you are still enjoying the starches (beans/wheat) and drinking plenty of water so whatever makes you (and your body) happy!
High carb, low fat, whole foods. Any questions?

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Re: Dr.McDougall -- The Starch Solution

#17 Postby AlexNLP » Thu Jul 05, 2012 7:32 am

I like his ideas and I think he's definitively a good advocate for a healthier eating.
Most of his ideas work for me. I do eat starchy foods but also mix it up with legumes, some raw veggies, fruits and nuts,seeds, tofu. I am just hungry every 1-2 hours if I don't eat complex carbs.

You guys should remember his advice is for a starch based Diet, and not starch only.
As far as I saw he isn't saying you should eat only starch.
His standard plan might be less compatible for somebody that has no muscles mass whatsoever. And wanna pack on some mass. Most people will probably need more Protein when training for muscles mass. I've tested this on myself. I couldn't gain much with 50g-60g protein.

It's understandable everybody think they are right and I respect that. But I can't agree with many ideas that people call "the best".
I am for once can't agree with raw only or fruitarians. Too much fiber from fruits or veggies makes my stomach unhappy. I can't really call eating only loads of bananas, mangoes and a few more fruits as balanced Diet. Or drinking mostly green or vegetable shakes etc...
For me it's unbalanced almost as your typical western animal based Diet.
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Re: Dr.McDougall -- The Starch Solution

#18 Postby SeventhDay » Thu Jul 05, 2012 10:54 am

Yeah. Well what I think HorseSense is saying is the science is there. Our bodys run off carbs, and it does best with high carbs low fat. Whether we "feel" it or not is relative. Because like you said, you don't feel right with all the fruit in you. So many factors can go into this...

You are right though, he does say make the meal based around a starch, and have unlimited amounts of fruits, veggies, nuts etc etc.
P.S. Legumes are starches.

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Re: Dr.McDougall -- The Starch Solution

#19 Postby Mufflon » Thu Jul 05, 2012 1:05 pm

SeventhDay wrote:Yeah. Well what I think HorseSense is saying is the science is there.

There is science for a lot of things out there and all these scientists and their followers claim to have it right. Paleo, Zone, 811, Atkins, Raw Food, South Beach etc. etc. etc. - and we can't know who's right.

It really is kind of amusing but it gets plain annoying when the followers of one of these or another diet get opinionated and zealous about their diet and trying to defend their chosen diet with everything they have. Someone is posting a link to a study that seems to support Paleo, then someone replies with a link to a study that seems to support 811 and it's always the same merry-go-round.

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Re: Dr.McDougall -- The Starch Solution

#20 Postby HorseSense » Thu Jul 05, 2012 3:16 pm

Sorry if I was argumentative. As Temple Grandin once said in an interview, there are two types of folks in this world - the idealist and the practical person. She said she was the practical type, as in, not "what would be ideal?" but "what can I do now?". This was her reply when asked why doesn't she just become vegan instead of "just" help end cruelty at holding facilities and slaughterhouses.

I'm the Idealist. I do not accept less than what is ideal, and that can get me in trouble sometimes. So sorry if I come across as preachy to others. lol
High carb, low fat, whole foods. Any questions?

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Re: Dr.McDougall -- The Starch Solution

#21 Postby SeventhDay » Thu Jul 05, 2012 3:18 pm

Mufflon wrote:
SeventhDay wrote:Yeah. Well what I think HorseSense is saying is the science is there.

There is science for a lot of things out there and all these scientists and their followers claim to have it right. Paleo, Zone, 811, Atkins, Raw Food, South Beach etc. etc. etc. - and we can't know who's right.

It really is kind of amusing but it gets plain annoying when the followers of one of these or another diet get opinionated and zealous about their diet and trying to defend their chosen diet with everything they have. Someone is posting a link to a study that seems to support Paleo, then someone replies with a link to a study that seems to support 811 and it's always the same merry-go-round.


I have nothing against anyone who eats paleo / primal / vegetarian etc. its there choice...
However... Paleo / Primal is proven to cause health problems... huge health problems. So we can just throw all that junk out.
So now were left with vegan. So were discussing which diet is best... High fat, Carb, or Protein or a mix.
Dr.McDougall promotes high carb low fat. There is much evidence and science out there to show this is
overall the best lifestyle eating plan out there. Now I'm talking TRUE evidence and science, not speculation,
biased studies, bro-science etc. History proves it, modern science proves it although modern man tends to hide it.

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Re: Dr.McDougall -- The Starch Solution

#22 Postby Mufflon » Fri Jul 06, 2012 1:12 pm

HorseSense wrote:Sorry if I was argumentative.

It wasn't directed at you. It's just a general observation.

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Re: Dr.McDougall -- The Starch Solution

#23 Postby Mufflon » Fri Jul 06, 2012 1:22 pm

SeventhDay wrote:So now were left with vegan. So were discussing which diet is best... High fat, Carb, or Protein or a mix.
Dr.McDougall promotes high carb low fat. There is much evidence and science out there to show this is
overall the best lifestyle eating plan out there. Now I'm talking TRUE evidence and science, not speculation,
biased studies, bro-science etc.
History proves it, modern science proves it although modern man tends to hide it.

Show me your science and I show you the science of other people claiming as well that they have found the holy nutrition grail. And of course all of their studies are "valid" as well... See my post about study contests above, I don't want to repeat myself.

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Re: Dr.McDougall -- The Starch Solution

#24 Postby Dillcue » Sun Jan 12, 2014 5:15 pm

I used to do the starch based thing until I got into weight training. I simply couldn't increase my performance with the low fat/protein levels. Dr. Mcdougall and his pals didn't really do the athlete thing anyway. They target audience are fat 40 year something folk who are at death's door. This website is mostly for athletes who are incidentally vegan.

Esselystn jr. made it work, so I don't know what to make of that.

But I'll keep my healthy sex drive and weight training gains over shaving seconds off my run/cycling times if it means eating olive oil, nuts, and seeds.

Did anyone else get gas problems with a low fat diet?

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Re: Dr.McDougall -- The Starch Solution

#25 Postby oldlunk » Sun Jan 12, 2014 6:45 pm

Veganessentials I'm with you on this one. You seem to be very wise on the subject of nutrition. I to try and follow 40/30/30 which seems to be proven scientifically on another bodybuilding site where they make their living at it. Some of which are medically enhanced and their diet are major factors in their physique.

Horsesense I have never tried the 80/10/10 but I do know of 1 bodybuilder who looks dam good eating that way. My resent research has not proofed to me the benefits. I do believe we need to listen to our bodies and what works for one might not work for others. I do include some starchy carbs in my diet.

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Re: Dr.McDougall -- The Starch Solution

#26 Postby bluebabe » Tue Jul 29, 2014 5:01 pm

I believe that some people who have problems with starch diet may actually have a problem with certain starchy foods and not the starch per se. Then ,when they change diet and stop or reduce eating those foods that were causing the problem, they feel better and believe the problem was the high starch instead of those specific foods.
Myself, having to deal with leaky gut, while following a starch solution program, make use only of roots and avoid all grains. To some people, avoiding gluten grains could be enough. I rarely see this issue addressed in such discussions and imo it's an important one.
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Re: Dr.McDougall -- The Starch Solution

#27 Postby Espirito » Fri Jan 13, 2017 11:32 am

I still can't figure out for myself what's the best for me.

Can you give a example, what you are eating in the 801010 or in the starch solution?

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Re: Dr.McDougall -- The Starch Solution

#28 Postby TankOnTwoLegs » Sun Jan 15, 2017 11:07 pm

I love a healthy nutritional debate! (I'm not including myself, I'll just toss in my two pennies)

I was raised that carbs were evil, carbs will make you fat, atkins this, low carb that, keto keto. I have disordered eating patterns that span from teenage to adulthood (I'm almost 30) because of this one side idea that carbs were the devil bobby.

I was overjoyed when I saw Dr McDougall on youtube and listened to what he had to say because for once, someone wasn't demonizing carbs.

I never jumped on the vegan wagon for animal rights like so many have (I'm terrible, I know) I went vegan because of my IBS and my destroyed digestive tract because of the years of disordered eating that I had. ( animal rights are a close second in this) My diet is mostly vegetable based carbs (potatoes, all kinds of potatoes and root veggies) I can mono meal on potatoes like noone's business and be so very happy. Occasionally, I'll do a pasta dish or a hispanic dish with spanish style rice and beans. Instant oatmeal makes me happy. I don't do much fake meat because it's expensive but I do enjoy it, and see/feel no ill effects. I steer away from fats outside of coconut and avocado because my body just can't digest it. So I feel like a diet..as in how one eats..really is based on how one feels about what they are eating and how the food reacts with their body. I think I'm on high carb, moderate protein, minimal fat. I couldn't give you a percentage of each macro though. I have a "food baby" at night and a flat belly in the morning, I feel wonderful, for the first time in my life I'm actually happy with what I eat and the food that I eat.

I don't think we can do a one size fits all diet for all humans. We're not in the wild, we're not even in the same environment nor habitats. All kinds of shit affects what our bodies can and cannot process. I know guys who do great as raw vegans, it's not for me. I know guys who do great on fake meats and vegan pizzas, it's not for me. (Though I can digest a good vegan pizza) My wife is a type 1 diabetic and I can assure you, high carb is definitely not for her lol.

It comes down to you doing you and me doing me. If our bloodwork is textbook, if our stool is easily passable, if our energy levels and hormone levels are balanced and optimal then I don't see anything wrong with eating what keeps you healthy and happy. And if that includes modifying some boxed cake mix to make vegan chocolate cake, go for it!

Just as a side note:I can't express the relief i feel being able to eat something without the fear of going into a relapse of disordered eating, that to me is worth more than anything anyone negative has to say about how I eat.
One of the best things about being a Vegan is that after a couple of weeks, your poop becomes so clean you barely have to wipe.

“If you can’t win, make the athlete ahead of you break the record.”

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Re: Dr.McDougall -- The Starch Solution

#29 Postby Espirito » Sun Jan 29, 2017 8:18 pm

TankOnTwoLegs wrote:I love a healthy nutritional debate! (I'm not including myself, I'll just toss in my two pennies)

I was raised that carbs were evil, carbs will make you fat, atkins this, low carb that, keto keto. I have disordered eating patterns that span from teenage to adulthood (I'm almost 30) because of this one side idea that carbs were the devil bobby.

I was overjoyed when I saw Dr McDougall on youtube and listened to what he had to say because for once, someone wasn't demonizing carbs.

I never jumped on the vegan wagon for animal rights like so many have (I'm terrible, I know) I went vegan because of my IBS and my destroyed digestive tract because of the years of disordered eating that I had. ( animal rights are a close second in this) My diet is mostly vegetable based carbs (potatoes, all kinds of potatoes and root veggies) I can mono meal on potatoes like noone's business and be so very happy. Occasionally, I'll do a pasta dish or a hispanic dish with spanish style rice and beans. Instant oatmeal makes me happy. I don't do much fake meat because it's expensive but I do enjoy it, and see/feel no ill effects. I steer away from fats outside of coconut and avocado because my body just can't digest it. So I feel like a diet..as in how one eats..really is based on how one feels about what they are eating and how the food reacts with their body. I think I'm on high carb, moderate protein, minimal fat. I couldn't give you a percentage of each macro though. I have a "food baby" at night and a flat belly in the morning, I feel wonderful, for the first time in my life I'm actually happy with what I eat and the food that I eat.

I don't think we can do a one size fits all diet for all humans. We're not in the wild, we're not even in the same environment nor habitats. All kinds of shit affects what our bodies can and cannot process. I know guys who do great as raw vegans, it's not for me. I know guys who do great on fake meats and vegan pizzas, it's not for me. (Though I can digest a good vegan pizza) My wife is a type 1 diabetic and I can assure you, high carb is definitely not for her lol.

It comes down to you doing you and me doing me. If our bloodwork is textbook, if our stool is easily passable, if our energy levels and hormone levels are balanced and optimal then I don't see anything wrong with eating what keeps you healthy and happy. And if that includes modifying some boxed cake mix to make vegan chocolate cake, go for it!

Just as a side note:I can't express the relief i feel being able to eat something without the fear of going into a relapse of disordered eating, that to me is worth more than anything anyone negative has to say about how I eat.


Can you give me a example of a typical day of eating ?
What fats do you consume in a day?

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Re: Dr.McDougall -- The Starch Solution

#30 Postby TankOnTwoLegs » Tue Jan 31, 2017 8:38 am

Breakfast is typically some kind of oatmeal
Lunch is either leftovers from the night before or a peanut butter jam sandwich or a mono meal of potatoes
Dinner is rice and beans, or pasta, or faux meat or a mono meal of potatoes if I didn't have them yet for the day

I think I stated I don't eat much fat outside of coconut and avocado, and that's pretty much it, plus the peanut butter for lunch. The rice and beans has a splash of olive oil in it. My body doesn't respond well to fat. I love nuts and seeds but I usually don't eat them because they're expensive, they can trigger some overeating tendencies for me and my body expels them pretty violently.
One of the best things about being a Vegan is that after a couple of weeks, your poop becomes so clean you barely have to wipe.

“If you can’t win, make the athlete ahead of you break the record.”


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