Vegan Bodybuilding & Fitness

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 Post subject: Carbs/fat reduction/body building
PostPosted: Wed Feb 06, 2013 8:17 pm 
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Rabbit

Joined: Sat Nov 19, 2011 9:19 pm
Posts: 11
Hi all,
I just started training with weights this week at the gym. I took the body fat analyzer and I am pretty high fat % at 33. (I don't exactly agree with this since I have reduced overall fat in the last 4 months or so) but for argument sake lets say that I am this amount. I am currently 150 lbs. In order to be fitness model/competitor I would have to drop 25 lbs of pure fat off my body which is doable. The issue though is my trainer is advising that I will need to reduce my carb intake, and increase my protein. He suggests I eat from 1000-1600 daily. 1000, seems super low, but 1600 more doable. Maybe he wrote the first figure erroneously, but again that's neither here nor there.

I cut out wheat. I eat some sugar, but am still eating too much. (2 1/2 teaspoon in my coffee, BUT this is the only added sugar I have. I did find out a way to drink my coffee without the additional sugar if I just buy a sweetened milk) I eat as a pre workout 2 fruits, and a small cup of all natural non sweetened juice. I do weights with my trainer, and then do a bodyrock as a cardio. Whatever the round is I add an additional one. Each day I have been doing this I have been toast by the time I am finished: totally spent. When I get home I was eating a couple fruit, but now I am going to a recovery shake. (mix of 1 scoop protein powder, 1/2 scoop Shakeology and banana with unsweetened almond milk).

I am not a huge fan of tofu or tempeh, and for the cutting out of the wheat I do not eat seitan. I do love beans, and eat these daily in different concoctions I make. I know quinoa is a great source of adding more protein, but again here is the carb issue...as well as for the beans. I love vegetables most, and because I live in the Northeast I love warm foods. I figure I would be a raw foodist if I lived in a climate that was nicer. (Just additional background since I eat a lot of raw veggies as well daily)

I want to continue my progress and I guess need more help with regards to food options, so that I can get to where I need to be. Unless having protein is a huge myth (which I believe is somewhat true) any suggestions for what I should/could be eating?

Any help would be greatly appreciated.

Thanks!


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 Post subject: Re: Carbs/fat reduction/body building
PostPosted: Thu Feb 07, 2013 7:32 am 
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Rabbit
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Joined: Thu Mar 08, 2012 7:20 pm
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Location: Dayton, OH
One thing I would ask is how much you trust your trainer. The second thing I would point out is that 1200 calories is clinical starvation and I highly doubt your trainer "legally" has the education or credentials to give such information. The next thing I would like to find out is what you were doing before and if it was working, ie, how many calories and what the ratio of carb/fat/protein was. If you were steadily losing a pound/1-2 weeks then changing it seems like a foolish move. Below I will post an unbiased video I did on protein just sharing the recommendations from the academy of nutrition and Dietetics for sedentary people through strength athletes.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-S5BAfN1YQY

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 Post subject: Re: Carbs/fat reduction/body building
PostPosted: Thu Feb 07, 2013 10:33 am 
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Rabbit

Joined: Sat Nov 19, 2011 9:19 pm
Posts: 11
I've been doing a mix of bodyrock and Turbofire prior to adding weight training over the last 4 or so months. During this time I was over eating still (just figured this out recently) along with still a lot of sugar. Since the beginning of January I really cleaned up my act with regards to eating clean. I've gained a lot of strength with BR and did in fact lose a lot of fat with TF. I stick currently with about 5-6 meals throughout the day and really listen to when my body is hungry. I do drink water as well to supplement but sometimes the hunger pangs don't go away so I know it's hunger. Since I've cleaned up my diet, over the last month I have seen really great results. I'm thinning out a lot, bones are showing (hip, ribs and collar if that matters) and I'm a size 6-8 from a size 8-10. My body is very curvy with a desire to hold my weight in my butt and thighs. It's been a painstakingly long process but I really believe it has to do with diet. I want quicker fat burning results I guess at this point for the amount of time I commit to this I don't want a 'normal' body. I want my body to reflect the dedication and hardwork I give to it. I only take 1 active rest day. I do bootcamp on one day, and run on the weekends. So in total my exercise regime is sound. I just don't know if I should use the BMI metrics to figure out how many calories I should be eating. It's such a delicate balance I think. :/


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 Post subject: Re: Carbs/fat reduction/body building
PostPosted: Thu Feb 07, 2013 11:08 am 
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Gorilla
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Joined: Sun Jan 22, 2012 4:31 pm
Posts: 516
The BMI metrics are pretty accurate. I used the standard weight to calorie ratio, and comparing that to the dietician that I see who uses a body analyzer it was maybe 100 calories off. I may not be the most help here since I'm gaining size and not trying to lose it.
That being said, I would think throwing weights into your routine is a great idea. Weights coupled with your previous routine will develop strength and muscle, which will in turn start burning more calories.

I am however have a strong opinion that results come slow if you make the properly, those are the ones that last. Keep your food regime under control, try subbing in agave nectar into your coffee instead of sugar. Higher GI, probably a little easier to digest and you literally only need a drop to sweeten a cup.

If you want your body to match your dedication you need to put in your time. My progress only started showing last month. I've been lifting for just over a year now. If you want to hold your weight in your thighs and butt I would hope you would be squatting.

Listen to your body, if you're hungry, you should eat. That's what it comes down to.


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 Post subject: Re: Carbs/fat reduction/body building
PostPosted: Thu Feb 07, 2013 12:02 pm 
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Rabbit

Joined: Sat Nov 19, 2011 9:19 pm
Posts: 11
If I followed the BMI calculator then I would be considered overweight which I'm not, since this measure does not account for muscle. I don't want to hold onto fat in my thighs and butt, I just do. This is my problem zone. I don't look at all, but my body composition according to the analyzer says my body is 1/3 fat- again this I don't believe it's accurate. The only real measure is water submerging and I don't have the availability of this in my area so I have to go with what I have.

For my routine, yes I do squats and lunges, in fact today was legs and I did various lower end exercise. It seems to me that many vegans that decide to be bodybuilders are on the other end of the spectrum: thin and want to gain mass, not trying to reduce body fat and gain muscle.


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 Post subject: Re: Carbs/fat reduction/body building
PostPosted: Thu Feb 07, 2013 6:51 pm 
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Gorilla
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Joined: Sun Jan 22, 2012 4:31 pm
Posts: 516
You could always do the measurements. I've seen a few pages where they just use measuring tape and a few calculations to get what they need to know.

There are a few people on the board that are quite the contrary actually. A few of the journals that I follow have lost a ton of weight but gained a substantially amount of muscle. Keep in mind a bunch of us can't be thrown into the bodybuilder title.
There's powerlifters, strongmen competitors a few crossfitters and a bunch of people that just like to track their progress.


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 Post subject: Re: Carbs/fat reduction/body building
PostPosted: Thu Feb 07, 2013 7:00 pm 
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Rabbit

Joined: Sat Nov 19, 2011 9:19 pm
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jamesxvx, I am looking to bodybuild so that I can eventually model. So that's my ultimate goal. But I just sent an email to my trainer to advise that after today's workout I reassessed things, and really want to focus on dropping weight rather then build at this point. Either way I will lean out, but if I drop the fat quicker then I will feel much better I think about my progress since I will actually see more of the underlying muscle.


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 Post subject: Re: Carbs/fat reduction/body building
PostPosted: Fri Feb 08, 2013 8:18 am 
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Manatee
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Location: Melbourne
Heyya,

Im not really qualified to give advice, but a journal in the Online Training Journals & Blogs could help you see the progress your making :)

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 Post subject: Re: Carbs/fat reduction/body building
PostPosted: Fri Feb 08, 2013 8:46 am 
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Rabbit

Joined: Sat Nov 19, 2011 9:19 pm
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I actually do have a journal or more preferably a workout book I use to write out all my exercises down in. But it looks like after I wrote back to my trainer with my new concern to drop fat and still tone he decided to have me do giant sets. Today we did full body workout and I completed my workout session with a bodyrock combo that was incredibly cardio intensive. 15 minutes 2 1/2 rounds. He advised that my cardio is fine and I can stick with it. I think just from my overall body soreness/fatigue that this will give me good results for this next month.


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 Post subject: Re: Carbs/fat reduction/body building
PostPosted: Fri Feb 08, 2013 1:41 pm 
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Manatee
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Location: chicago, il
Just my $0.02, I'm not sure that the online body fat % calculators that use measurements such as hips, waist, and wrist are really all that much more accurate. They might be for certain body types, but definitely not for all body types. I don't really have much of a reason for thinking this other than personal application (If I just put in my measurements those sites tell me I'm around 26-28% bodyfat, which simply isn't even close to true), however, so ymmv.

Good luck with your new plan! I always try to view my muscle soreness/fatigue in a positive light, too ;)

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 Post subject: Re: Carbs/fat reduction/body building
PostPosted: Fri Feb 08, 2013 3:19 pm 
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Rabbit

Joined: Thu Jan 05, 2012 5:51 pm
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I'm guessing you're a woman, maybe I missed it, but at 33% body fat and seeing bones I think it's a good guess. women will always carry more fat. a woman at 10% looks like a man at 5%. here's a great guide to body fat for women. IMO the mirror is the best judge:
Image

Without tofu or seitan I'd be carrying a lot more fat than I do. I think you'll need to rely on a lot of protein shakes to lean out at 1200 calories per day.

Here's the men picture too for comparison:
Image


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 Post subject: Re: Carbs/fat reduction/body building
PostPosted: Fri Feb 08, 2013 3:37 pm 
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Rabbit

Joined: Sat Nov 19, 2011 9:19 pm
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So how about raw vegan body builders? I can imagine they are using other food sources that don't rely on tofu or seitan. When looking at the chart, I think the 30% female figure is the best: since she is te most curvy. I personally am quite similar to her shape just thinner. Luckily for me I won't lose my shape but just reduce the body fat. Some women just are very curvy and that's genetics and I have my mom to thank for that. ;)


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 Post subject: Re: Carbs/fat reduction/body building
PostPosted: Fri Feb 08, 2013 4:23 pm 
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Manatee
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Location: chicago, il
It is not always true that females carry more fat or that the definition/structure of a female at 10% will be similar to a male at 5%.
What is true is that breast tissue is mostly fat, so individuals with a lot of breast tissue will have more fat. This includes females and males with medical conditions such as gynecomastia. If an individual doesn't carry much breast tissue, their body fat % will be lower, regardless of sex. Yes this generally correlates to sex, but it's incorrect to say that women will always carry more fat than men. The general pattern of fat deposits found on most females is certainly not true for all females. There's tons of genetic variances that could account for different patterns of fat collection/muscle development, and your chromosomes are only one of them. To look at just chromosomal make-up as an indicator of where a certain individual will keep fat deposits just isn't as reliable as you may assume.
I know that females are also said to carry excess fat around the reproductive organs, as well, but one could make the similar arguments regarding this as I have already made regarding breast tissue. If you carry abdominal fat, you carry abdominal fat. Period. Regardless of sex.

Don't mean to harp, just a pet peeve of mine when an assumption is made that "women's bodies carry fat in this manner and men's bodies carry fat in this other manner" when chromosomes are really just one part of what is a hugely intricate genetic code that accounts for a lot of these differences. It seems to me to not be far from the old idea that females can't do pull-ups because of differences in upper body musculature, which as we all know simply isn't true, either.

As for raw vegan body builders, there is plenty of protein that can be gleaned from raw produce, and dry beans can be sprouted and be edible without the need to boil/cook. It might be a little/a lot more difficult, but there's no reason a raw body builder couldn't get sufficient protein if they structured their eating correctly.

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 Post subject: Re: Carbs/fat reduction/body building
PostPosted: Fri Feb 08, 2013 4:48 pm 
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Finch

Joined: Fri Feb 08, 2013 4:40 pm
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I just started training with weights this week at the gym.

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Last edited by johnd787 on Sun Feb 16, 2014 9:47 am, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject: Re: Carbs/fat reduction/body building
PostPosted: Fri Feb 08, 2013 5:31 pm 
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Rabbit

Joined: Sat Nov 19, 2011 9:19 pm
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beansnbroccoli, just as a heads up I never implied that women tend to hold fat more so then men. I was advising how my body holds onto fat, and that is definitively related to genetics since my family is all obese or overweight. I have the same exact shape as my mother did when she was young, so genetics play a crucial part in body form.

I was stating a fact about raw vegan bodybuilders, that they can build and eat all raw and still get amazing results.


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