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Jamie Oliver Killer of cute baby chicks


Amy
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I still do not understand his motivation.....obviously he has no qualms about using eggs or killing animals.....alot of omnis I know eat meat but could never actually kill an an animal....IF it was vegan chef.....then I would disagree but understand...he can't really want people to be shocked into being vegan or stop using eggs...because his cookbook sales would go down and less people would watch his show. By continuing to use eggs in his recipes he is a hypocrite...oh look animals die...it's horrible....try my new 4 egg spinach omelet. I'm a Buddist or trying to become one so nonviolent protest is the only way I think messages should be sent I can't agree with causing harm to anything for any reason. Violence does not solve anything. IMHO

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Fair play to him for acknowledging the truth about egg production and bringing it to wider public attention.

 

 

What if he had taken some teenage girls from Thailand and auctioned them off on live television to show the reality of the sex industry in Thailand....props then???

Everyone has become way too desensitized to the killing and torture of animals even vegans...The thing is The strong are going to continue to subjugate the weak humans and animals...one retarted tv stunt by someone whose motivations are completely unclear is not going to change that. The news guy obviously was not affected by it he is having chicken tonight.....this is Jamie Olivers gimmick..nothing else

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I still do not understand his motivation.....obviously he has no qualms about using eggs or killing animals.....alot of omnis I know eat meat but could never actually kill an an animal....IF it was vegan chef.....then I would disagree but understand...he can't really want people to be shocked into being vegan or stop using eggs...because his cookbook sales would go down and less people would watch his show. By continuing to use eggs in his recipes he is a hypocrite...oh look animals die...it's horrible....try my new 4 egg spinach omelet. I'm a Buddist or trying to become one so nonviolent protest is the only way I think messages should be sent I can't agree with causing harm to anything for any reason. Violence does not solve anything. IMHO

If you’re going to eat an animal it makes no difference whatsoever to the animal if you killed it or somebody else did. It has still been murdered.

 

I can’t differentiate being omnis’s ‘merely’ eating an animal or omni’s personally killing and eating an animal. If you are going to consume an animal you’re just as responsible for it’s death, even though someone else may have committed the slaughter. You haven’t got any less blood on your hands.

 

A vegan chef wouldn’t kill chicks though would they?

What if he had taken some teenage girls from Thailand and auctioned them off on live television to show the reality of the sex industry in Thailand....props then???

Most people are aware of the reality of the sex trade in SE Asia. It’s not exactly hidden. Most people still don’t know the truth about how eggs are produced, which is hidden, so I don’t think your comparison is viable.

 

If people are going to eat eggs then they should be confronted with the full impact of doing so.

 

He is highlighting and bringing to wider attention what many people still don’t know.

 

Or perhaps you would prefer it to continue to go on behind closed doors, with few people aware of it? Out of sight and out of mind and all that…

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I doubt anyone became vegan because of that stunt....or stopped using eggs....if he had given the chicks to people in the audience that wanted them as pets that probably would have had more impact....it's not easy to eat things after you name them precisely why you don't see dog or car meat in the freezer section. And they don't even bother to gas the male chicks on an egg farm...they just throw them away....if he really wanted to show reality of the situation he would have fed those baby chicks to the snake live...or....broken their necks or just threw them in the trash can. He saved those chicks just to kill them anyway...and it most likely will not make any difference. I just want to get to the bottom of his motivations he is not a vegan chef he uses eggs... This is what makes me angry..... this was not to show the reality of egg production..why does he care...I bet alot of people in the audience thought it was cool and he will probably get more people to come his show if they know it is not going to be just cooking. People know you have to kill animals to eat them they aren't stupid they just don't care. We learn as children from our parents that it is ok to eat certain animals. I think people know about egg production more now because of the popularity of " free range" and organic eggs. Even if they don't know someone that eats meat does not care that an animal has to die to get it...why would they care if an animal dies during egg production. Maybe some vegetarians in the audience turned vegan but not necessarily.My boyfriend is a vegetarian and I showed him the site and he still makes egg sandwiches and eats cheese like it is going out of style because he wants to. Even though he knows what goes on at a milk farm.

 

I am not sure about the widespread knowledge of the sex trade in SE asia....I did not know about it until I read this tiny article in the back of Jane 2 years ago. I never see anything about it on the news. MY aunt and uncle went there for a honeymoon and never said anything about it...they have actually been to Thailand many times and said it was

beautiful. They aren't exactly auctioning off girls on the street you have to know where to go.

 

but maybe they should do it in the open so people know about it.

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And those chicks did not exactly sign up to martyrs....they did not have to be killed to show anything...I think footage of chicks that were already killed would have been fine...he could have saved those chicks and still brought a severe situation to peoples attention and saved animals in a nonviolent way... but if he cared enough to do that he would probably be a vegan. . I do not agree with violence for any reason. ... And I think people that can't kill things themselves are more compassionate than people that can and have the personality to become vegan. Someone that can kill an animal for no reason ( he did not even use it for anything) is not going to become a vegan anytime soon.

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Maybe it'd be easier to understand the point if I attach some numbers to the values:

 

Killing an animal in a slaughterhouse = -999,999,999,999,999

 

Killing an animal live on TV = -999,999,999,999,998

 

Not killing an animal = 0

 

Giving the animal a home and looking after it = 100

 

in the grand scale, killing an animal on TV or killing it in a slaughterhouse isn't much different, but it is marginally better for it to happen on TV. Similarly, it's better for sex slaves to be auctioned off on TV rather than in private, but it's only "better" by a tiny margin, and it still is not "good" in any way.

 

Being stabbed once is better than being stabbed twice, but it doesn't make being stabbed once any better in itself just because it's being compared to something worse, can you dig it?

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I appreciate the effort but I still think it is the same and I hope there is never a time when The killing of animals unnecessarily does not piss me off to no end or I agree with it at all. Because that is why I am vegan first and foremost because I believe killing animals when you don't have to ...to survive anymore is wrong and I wont condone it in anyway. They would have been killed at an egg farm but when he took those chicks their fate no longer was sealed....he chose to continue the bloody cycle.

 

and jamie olivers idea of 'reality' is skewed...... at an egg farm male chicks aren't killed with wacky music playing in the background then fed to a huge snake......

 

he's a creep

Edited by Emmybear
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Well, I'm not condoning it, I'm saying that both are unacceptable, but one is a slightly worse atrocity than the other. Like, being put in an iron maiden is worse than having your head cut off. Neither is something I'd sign up for, but in the event that it is going to be one or the other, I'd rather not go in the iron maiden. That doesn't mean I condone decapitation. Jamie Oliver, and everybody else, should not kill animals.

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I understand I know anyone that is a vegan does not condone killing animals......I just think if he really wanted to change things he would gone about it a different way.....the whole stunt makes no sense.

 

I hope the public killing of animals does not become a gimmick or something I see everyday...that would make life very unpleasant for me seeing as I wont even watch the discovery channel because an animal always dies...

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No, the vast majority would not have changed their dietary habits after Oliver's actions, but it would have got some thinking, and some of those - not all straight away, but over time - will alter their diet as a result.

 

Maybe it's different in the US, but here in the UK nearly all chicks are gassed or minced alive. There's simply not enough pet snakes - anywhere - for male chicks to be disposed of that way, but won't deny some chicks are especially unfortunate to die that way.

 

Yeah, free range and organic eggs are more popular now, but that's out of concern for battery hens, and not due to any awareness of the implications for male chicks.

 

Jamie Oliver does care - to an extent, but not to the level that would satisfy a vegan. I watched the program when it was televised over here a few months back. It's aim was for improved welfare for battery hens and broiler chickens. Yeah, he did leave the question of the male chicks unanswered - I got the impression that he thought that it was a necessary evil if people wanted to continue to consume eggs. He confronted the issue though, no he didn't provide any solutions and refused to see the obvious one, but he could of just ignored it and pretend it didn't happen, which he could of quite easily done.

 

No, those chicks didn't ask to become martyrs just as countless billions of other male chicks didn't ask to be killed.

 

I dunno about people unable to do any killing themselves being more compassionate. I could hire a hitman to bump off a rival - does that make me any more compassionate as I've got someone to do the killing on my behalf?

 

I've been to Thailand a few times. It's pretty common knowledge even if you've never been, pretty much inescapable to notice if you've actually been there. They are girls on the street - they're outside bars in the street trying to entice customers to come into their bar for a drink and more... You don't have to deliberately seek it out. You don't have to be in a vice area of a town or one of the more notorious resorts - you can be walking around the centre of a resort of a evening and very hard not to walk past a girlie bar, even if you've no desire to frequent such places. You don't have to know where to go - you'll probably inadvertantly come across such places just walking about any tourist resort - not just the fleshpots - and it is pretty much in the open already. They don't make a secret of it.

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Maybe it's different in the US, but here in the UK nearly all chicks are gassed or minced alive. There's simply not enough pet snakes - anywhere - for male chicks to be disposed of that way, but won't deny some chicks are especially unfortunate to die that way.

 

I dunno, I just finished reading 'Skinny Bitch' last week and Rory was talking about how ex employees said they just threw away the live chicks in a big pile of garbage and that was that, left to die one on top of another. Maybe they were still minced alive or whatever, who knows.

 

Whatever the case, the whole thing is highly disturbing and this display was horrible. I'd care to wager that it would make some think twice eventually. ou never know what type of situation will influence someone in a certain wahy; however I don't agree with what he did.....

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The thing is most people do not regard the mass murder of people and the mass murder of animals for human consumption as comparable. They want to eat meat, eggs and milk and have few qualms about the killing of animals necessary to provide their chosen diet.

 

 

 

You obviously do not equate the murder of animals to the murder of people so your hit man comparison is invalid.....we are brought up to believe killing animals for food is acceptable our inner morals are overridden by the brainwashing of society.....it's not easy to go against what is 'normal"

 

 

And if what you say is true about Thailand obviously the public trade of girls as sex slaves has no impact on anyone...It is still a popular American vacation spot....so what they sell girls.....the beaches are nice. The only thing publication of atrocities does is desensitize the public to it.....you grow up seeing girls traded like baseball cards...it's normal....you grow up seeing animals die on tv...it's normal and you go on with your life

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I am against all murder, both human (though not in a military situation) and animal. What I actually said is most (non-vegan) people - and by that I obviously wasn’t including myself – do not regard the killings of animals and humans as comparable.

 

My hit-man comparison is valid. You stated that someone who gets someone else to do the killing on their behalf is more compassionate. It doesn’t matter what you’re killing – a person or an animal – but you’re no less responsible if you don’t personally commit the killing. I could go and select a live oyster at a seafood restaurant – am I more compassionate than the chef just because he’s the one who drops it in the pot?

 

I wouldn’t lie about Thailand. Why would I want to over-exaggerate the extent of the sex industry there? Of course it has an impact on people, just because they cannot stop it doesn’t mean that people are not affected or disturbed by it. Yeah it’s still popular tourist location – probably the main reason the place got so popular in the first place was because of the sex industry – but what does a boycott by non sex tourists achieve? Some people employed in the tourist trade would lose their jobs, and some of those would subsequently have to work in the sex trade. So many people visit there as it's a fascinating and beautiful place with much, much more to it than hookers.

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A mother buying meat for her family because she was raised into thinking meat is essential for a healthy diet is in no way comparable to someone hiring a hit man to murder another person . I think that if the general public was forced to kill their own animals for consumption there would be more vegetarians out there....

 

 

I never presumed you were lying it is just hard for me to picture a terrible situation like that...and I would not want to visit a place where teenage girls are treated like objects...

 

 

If everyone was vegan that would cause the people in the meat industry to lose their jobs....

 

So what? maybe the lack of tourists will illicit the government to do something about the TRADE OF TEENAGE Girls

 

I'm new to forum posting but my boyfriend made a good point I'm spending more time on the internet versus doing productive things...arguing my opinion on the internet is not really going to change anything and really is not positive in any way I'm going back to only posting my meals and voting in contests and being done with it.

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That wasn't the point you were making though. You claimed someone was more compassionate if they didn't do the actual killing themselves though, and I used the hitman example to dispute this. The mother may believe she is doing the right thing, and may be unaware of what really goes on with factory farming, but in my eyes she is not more compassionate just because an abattoir does the dirty work on her behalf.

 

Prostitution goes on everywhere, not just Thailand, it happens in the US and UK too, it's just less in your face.

 

It's not just teenage girls, grown women too.

 

We want people involved in the meat industry to be no longer employed in that sector, we don't want people involved in a secondary - unrealted - industry to also be affected as a consequence.

 

I just think boycotting a place because of it's vice trade is counter-productive if it penalises and has a negative effect on people that are employed in sectors that have nothing to do with vice.

 

Sorry, I don't mean for you to be put off posting your view. Nothing personal. I'm just having a discussion with you over what we think of Jamie Oliver's actions. Your questioning me, I'm questioning you, that's all. Don't be put off expressing your opinion because some may dispute it. You are just as entitled to voice your opinion as I.

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We started debating Jamie oliver....now we are talking about Thai hookers ......and it is a mute point waste of time he killed the chicks already can't do anything about it now....I just hope this does not become a regular part of his show. Despite your arguments I still doubt it will do any good. I got sick of discussing this with you because you have not picked a side...you are defending Jamie Oliver for his cruel actions toward animals...but condemning others for theirs. You use the argument of an omni buying meat like a person paying a hit man for murder but completely dismiss my comparison of cruelty to humans as being the same as cruelty to animals.

 

 

 

I certainly hope you do not think I am so naive as to be unaware that women sell their bodies for sex. If a woman believes that is her only recourse so be it. Porn stars are 18 and it is The same thing and that is legal...because they are 18! You cannot compare this to The Thai sex trade where girls as young as eight are sold by their families into sexual slavery. IT is basically slavery and child porn rolled into one.

Edited by Emmybear
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Jamie Oliver & Hugh Fearnly Whitingstall (friends) are both meat eaters.On that basis im not overly keen on them.

 

They have however been campaigning to an ignorant english public about the badness of factory farming & trying to encourage people to eat free range.After hughs show about chickens, free range chicken sales tripled here in the UK.For those not familiar with him or his show, he basically did the same as Jamie but with adult chickens not chicks.Those few animals they have killed have saved possibly millions of others & changed alot of peoples views here in the UK.Both guys got no praise or money for the shows & actually risked becoming exremely unpopular but did it for the animals.

 

Respect to both of them for what they have done.But they should still go vegan

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  • 2 weeks later...

Oliver stabbed that sheep in the throat whilst it was still conscious. It happened during the making of his programmes about Italian food in 2005. His excuse was that, as he has cooked a lot of sheep meat in his time, he should be able to kill one. I think the word he used was 'authentic'. It made him authentic to kill what he has cooked.

 

What he did, apart from being incredidbly cruel was illegal. In the EU all sheep, except those killed for moslem or Jewish ritual purposes, must be stunned before slaughter. Those that are killed as part of this ritual slaughter must be killed in a slaughterhouse.

 

Oliver said that it is allowed for Italian farmers to kill animals without stunning if the animal is killed for their own personal consumption. Rubbish! Even they must be stunned first. It is EU law.

 

In the link I give below some Italian cook said:

 

'This has been going on for thousands and thousands of years, since the time of Christ. This is very common in Italy, it is very traditional.'

 

 

Which is irrelevant. It was cruel. Rape has been going on for thousands of years in Italy, too.

 

Don't believe the nonsense about the kosher and hallal methods causing instantaneous unconsciouness. They don't. And this wasn't by those methods. It was a knife in the neck done in a field. The sheep will have suffered extreme pain and terror.

 

On his forum he was praised for his bravery. And some people almost chuckled about how tasty sheep meat is.

 

http://www.tios.co.za/index.php?fArticleId=2991484&fSectionId=1014&fSetId=

 

 

As for the chickens, they looked quite peaceful as they died. They weren't, but they looked it. They should have shown the maceration process - which would have been quicker and probably less cruel, but with lots of bright blood splashing about. That might have changed a few minds. I don't think the sight of some chickens going to sleep will put many off their omelates and cakes. Anyone who is campaigning for animal rights - which oliver isn't, as he makes his living by cooking them - should also stress how unhealthy animal products are and how they are damaging to the whole world. This, as well as showing the cruelty and suffering, would be more effective. Most humans usually only do things that benefit them in some way, so they have to be shown how giving up meat is good for them.

 

I really don't know what his point was. Yes, he said that it was to show people the reality. But why? He wasn't asking people to give up using eggs. He is not giving them up. To use Emmybear's analogy: if someone wanted to highlight the Thailand sex trade but continued to use Thai girl prostitutes, what would be his point?

 

Oliver had the chickens brought to the studio. He could have had them taken to an animal shelter afterwards and just shown film footage of the slaughter.

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Free range chickens and Cage free eggs are no better off than regular eggs. They are still subject to the painful de-beaking process made to sit in their own excrement given exuberant amount of hormones and the male chicks are still destroyed.

 

Cage -free is a buzz word used to lure consumers into a peaceful nights sleep. Buy continuing to use eggs the Cooks are sending a message it is ok to abuse animals for our own gain and have done nothing for the animals.

 

How do you know they weren't paid by the cage free egg companies? How can vegans defend these cruel actions? Nothing has been gained by these stunts except more suffering.

 

I still think people who cannot kill animals themselves have more compassion and ability to be compassionate they have just been brainwashed by those who profit off killing animals. When I was an omni I could have never hurt an animal I ate meat because I was a child brainwashed by my relatives that eating meat was ok and animals were for eating...I got violent opposition from my family and everyone else I knew that I was told I would I would be sick and weakly..I stopped eating all animal products when I was 12 but was literally forced back into consuming eggs and dairy by my family.....It took a few years after I moved out on my own to break free of the hype...Do you really think a person that can slit a lambs throat or go hunting for sport is going to come to the same conclusion anytime soon?

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I didnt see the sheep thing - it sounds awful.

 

I was only commenting on the chicken thing, & yes it was still wrong.You do have to bear in mind that it raised awareness, if nothing else.I bet it made some viewers vegetarian.It only has to change one viewer into a vegetarian who would have consumed hundreds of chickens in their life - to have outweighed the 5 chicks he killed.

 

Granted however that footage showing may have had the same effect.

 

Still what do we expect from these meat eaters? Some compassion? Some intelligence?

 

If they had either of these they would be vegans.

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