Protein Confusion!

[Alychef]

I'm new to all of this...I've previously been using a soya protein powder to supplement my diet until I was told that too much processed soya isn't that good for you. Then I started looking at hemp products and then came across brown rice and pea proteins!!!

 

I've looked at vega, and whilst it sounds really good, I wouldn't be able to afford it. I've just ordered some hemp protein isolate powder which is 95% protein, but little else. I do have a good diet full of differetn coloured fruit and veg and lots of seeds and nuts etc. I take supplements too.

 

Any advice on the protein thing would be much appreciated.

 

Aly

[osric]

Hi Aly,

 

Consensus seems to be a that a variety of protein sources are the best way to supplement.

 

I use a variety of sources, including Vega (mostly hemp), Nitrofusion (a blend), and Builder's Bars (soy). Some of this stuff can be hard to choke down as is, so a blender is your friend.

 

Effectiveness depends on your own body chemistry and activity level, so take the guidelines as a starting point and see what works for you.

 

Writing down what you're eating and when you're eating is the best way to find the gaps in your diet (and in your training!). This helps me make sure I keep eating lots of whole foods and don't become a supplement junkie.

 

I'm sure others here will have lots to say on this topic...

 

Osric

[beforewisdom]

If you legumes/legume derived foods and whole grains/whole grain derived foods at every meal you probably do not need to supplement protein....or only by a little bit ( one protein drink a day should be more than enough unless you are really busting your ass ).

[CollegeB]

yeah too much protein will put pounds on you like a big mac. I dont worry much about that though. Like the others say vary the sources. try trueprotein.com they've got good deals on gemma which is a pea protein. The flavors are real iffy though in terms of deliciousness.

[veginator]

If you legumes/legume derived foods and whole grains/whole grain derived foods at every meal you probably do not need to supplement protein....or only by a little bit ( one protein drink a day should be more than enough unless you are really busting your ass ).

 

I second that. We were all brainwashed when we were omnivores into believing that humans (especially bodybuilders) need huge amounts of protein and also that it's not possible to get adequate protein from a diet without animal products. It's tough to fully break out of that mindset, I think, but there's no evidence that I'm aware of that consuming large amounts of protein is even helpful for building significant muscle, let alone necessary. (veganmaster's blog cites some research on this.) In addition to the fact that, obviously, large herbivores such as dinosaurs, elephants and cows have never taken a protein supplement (cows in the US get fed growth hormone, but not protein supplements as far as I know), there are people on this very site who have nicely muscled bodies but don't take protein supplements.

 

My understanding is that creatine (and, of course, steroids, but don't take those!) is more effective than protein supplements.

[CollegeB]

if creatine is the key then that is true we are not getting enough since its not found in a vegan diet from what I know.

[Alychef]

Wow no way! Do you mean pounds as in excess fat or muscle! I didn't realise that excess protein could be stored...or did I get that wrong???

I don't want to be huge, of course...but I do want some serious deifinition.

yeah too much protein will put pounds on you like a big mac. I dont worry much about that though. Like the others say vary the sources. try trueprotein.com they've got good deals on gemma which is a pea protein. The flavors are real iffy though in terms of deliciousness.

[CollegeB]

It was said long ago on this forum by someone more informed than me that extra (unused) protein will turn to fat. It could be false for all I really know.

[DV]

Alychef,

 

You can find numerous sources stating different minimums for protein intake. There is a lot of confusion out there and no one has THE definitive answer. If you are looking to maintain your current lean mass then your requirements will be different from someone who is looking to gain muscle. You can research this further and decide for yourself if you believe you need as little as 0.8 gm/kg up to 2 gm/kg+. As a vegan, if you are worried about not getting a sufficient amount of a particular amino acid, then eat somewhere in the middle to upper range, IMO. Most plants contain all amino acids, so eating a varied diet and eating more than the minimum amount of protein will assure that you are meeting your requirements. I personally believe that bodybuilding vegans, especially those who eat mainly whole foods, have a higher protein requirement than those who are eating refined or highly bio-available protein sources - due to protein availability. So I eat 1.5 to 2 gms/kg of whole protein per day (more when bulking, less when maintaining). But that's just me and I eat 2700-3000 kcal per day so that intake is easily obtained. My protein needs would be less if I had a higher fat percentage, so a 155 lb woman at 30% bodyfat who is not bodybuilding would not have my requirements for instance - since she would have less muscle to maintain and would not be looking to build new muscle.

 

As for supplementation with factory-produced powders - not necessary, IMO, but many use them. I've used them in the past but am no longer a fan. Keep in mind that they are a highly refined "food" made from very cheap sources - so there's a lot of advertising and hype that goes into them since the profit margin is high. You've been told that too much processed soya is not good for you. I would argue that processed pea, rice, wheat, sugar, etc. is not good for you either.

 

Creatine is found in muscle (human/animal), so vegans make their own. Our requirement is approximately 2 gms per day and the average American eats 1 gm per day in the form of meat. The precursors for creatine are arginine, glycine and methionine and are synthesized primarily in the liver and kidney (possibly some pancreas activity, depending on the sources I've read). Some people are "responders" when it comes to creatine supplementation and some are not. There have been (a few) studies which indicate that some vegans/vegetarians are responders - but the studies do not indicate the overall protein intake of those vegans/vegetarians in the studies (from what I've seen). If you wish to supplement with creatine to see if you are a responder then you will have even more questions about loading doses, timing of intake, what to eat when taking the supplement, etc. There are many studies out there on creatine as it's been around for a long time. When I've used it, I've "loaded" on no more than 5 gms per day and maintained on 2-3 gms thereafter (I don't see the point in ingesting more since my body cannot utilize more than that, but the studies have been done with higher doses).

 

Protein, fat and carbohydrate can all be stored as fat - if you ingest more calories than you expend. If you are not looking to get big and are looking for more definition then your overall protein needs may not be very high - this all depends on your current weight, lean body mass and fat mass.

 

Good luck with your goals!