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Vegan Alcohol


Dr. Pink
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I think the purpose of this topic is not to discuss the ethics of drinking alcohol, Pink wants to know what vegan alcohol there is.

 

I second that. If people wish to make broad (and in my opinion ridiculous) generalizations about how drinking any alcohol at all by anyone is bad, they should do it in a different thread.

 

The first question the OP asked was "Anyone here drink?"

No where did it state that you had to answer only YES or NO.

Sorry if you can't take, or understand elaborate answers.

Maybe having to ponder your own personel alcohol use is what is making you uncomfortable here.

What's even more worrysome is you opinion that some of my quotes and statement are ridiculous.

But I quess that's your problem.

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I have a few drinks from time to time, perhaps once or twice per week (usually while going over business paperwork after hours), but rarely go beyond 2-3 in an evening. As for my preference, I enjoy good scotch and some nice Belgian ales, which are usually my go-to choices when I'm out and about as I rarely have the desire for a drink while I'm home. There are a good share of vegan options out there, but as has been mentioned, wine is one of the trickier ones since many brands still use fish-based isinglass filters for their clarifying processes.

 

I respect everyone's decision whether they choose to have a few drinks or not. It's not for everyone, so if someone wants to abstain, that's completely fine and I back their decision. However, for those that have vehement anti-alcohol positions and speak of it in the same realm as if having a drink on occasion is similar to being a junkie or that it leads to criminal behavior, I do have to chuckle. It's one thing to be opposed to something based on your own experiences and ideals, and completely different when one's opposition becomes overhyped fearmongering with scare tactics that basically say that one drink will likely lead to your ultimate ruin. It's fine to voice dissent in regard to the idea of drinking, but let's not turn this thread into a Reefer Madness-esque carnival, please. Some of us have managed to responsibly enjoy a glass from time to time without driving drunk, beating our spouses, abusing children or anything else of that nature, and we're quite content to keep doing as we've done

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I respect everyone's decision whether they choose to have a few drinks or not. It's not for everyone, so if someone wants to abstain, that's completely fine and I back their decision. However, for those that have vehement anti-alcohol positions and speak of it in the same realm as if having a drink on occasion is similar to being a junkie or that it leads to criminal behavior, I do have to chuckle. It's one thing to be opposed to something based on your own experiences and ideals, and completely different when one's opposition becomes overhyped fearmongering with scare tactics that basically say that one drink will likely lead to your ultimate ruin. It's fine to voice dissent in regard to the idea of drinking, but let's not turn this thread into a Reefer Madness-esque carnival, please. Some of us have managed to responsibly enjoy a glass from time to time without driving drunk, beating our spouses, abusing children or anything else of that nature, and we're quite content to keep doing as we've done

 

Very Well said VE, I was trying to think of a polite way to say something just like this and no going very well.

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I respect everyone's decision whether they choose to have a few drinks or not. It's not for everyone, so if someone wants to abstain, that's completely fine and I back their decision. However, for those that have vehement anti-alcohol positions and speak of it in the same realm as if having a drink on occasion is similar to being a junkie or that it leads to criminal behavior, I do have to chuckle. It's one thing to be opposed to something based on your own experiences and ideals, and completely different when one's opposition becomes overhyped fearmongering with scare tactics that basically say that one drink will likely lead to your ultimate ruin. It's fine to voice dissent in regard to the idea of drinking, but let's not turn this thread into a Reefer Madness-esque carnival, please. Some of us have managed to responsibly enjoy a glass from time to time without driving drunk, beating our spouses, abusing children or anything else of that nature, and we're quite content to keep doing as we've done

 

Very Well said VE, I was trying to think of a polite way to say something just like this and no going very well.

 

Same here, well said. Especially that last sentence.

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This thread makes vegans look even more like the awkward, sociopathic weirdos that society at large makes us out to be.

 

This is overall not a good thing.

 

Agreed. Good point. If you don't want to drink, then don't drink. But moralizing about others drinking as if everyone who has a beer is a drunk-driving, wife-beating addict is not only silly and ridiculous, but also makes for a poor impression of veganism.

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This thread makes vegans look even more like the awkward, sociopathic weirdos that society at large makes us out to be.

 

This is overall not a good thing.

 

 

I'm not a fan of alcohol but I can appreciate your comment Josh. I'm doing more and more of that kind of analyzation about veganism being viewed by the general public. As many on here know, I moved from being a "vegan" speaker to a motivational speaker, being part of much more mainstream media and mainstream projects than fringe idealistic pathways that were connected with veganism. I took a lot of heat over the past couple of years as I criticized veganism (including some of my articles and statements on this forum) in ways that were intended to actually reduce animal suffering in greater ways, and I believe I did that through my actions. I embraced a lifestyle that the general public could really resonate with and appreciate, all the while promoting veganism to a larger audience speaking in terms of the audience's interests, not my own personal agenda. I believe it was far more effective and the feedback I've received has supported that notion.

 

So I can appreciate more and more the concept of making veganism look more desirable from the outside looking in. I imagine Josh, we're minorities on this opinion, even within the forum, but I hope I'm wrong.

 

I was very impressed with my friend who is one of the most "radical" or "hardcore" vegans I know personally, who just sat down with me the other day and said that she has changed a lot of her "tactics" and approaches because she finally realized that on a large scale, despite her incredible caring and selfless intentions, she was actually having an adverse affect on veganism from the perspective of non-vegan people in her community observing her behavior and wanting nothing to do with veganism, and in fact despising it as a result.

 

There is no doubt I'm not fan of alcohol (alcohol-free my entire 28 years) but I wholeheartedly agree with your comment Josh and about how veganism is perceived from others who will find any bait that they can to make us look obscure and incapable of being extraordinary and thoughtful citizens because of the label that defines our lifestyle.

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Its things like this that make me so very contrarian. It takes a good week to reclaim the term vegan to people that don't know much about it when they meet me. They come in with all these stereotypes. I'm really damn sick of it actually, and it's not the public's fault...well, it sort of is since they aren't vegan and are not up on the issues, but equally to blame are those from the sky is falling camp which tends to make arguments (despite their merit) based largely on fear, and conjecture. I am not too surprised by this though. These types of arguments get a lot of response and that conditions people to continue to make them (this is not just a vegan thing by any means). I'm very relieved that there are a few rational vegans left on this forum. We're a fringe group made of fringe people, that's for sure. Lets keep the diversity and tactful discussion but ditch the disrespect and hystrionic arguments. I think the reaction to this thread from the forum community is a good indicator that that type of language has got to go. Get on board, or get out.

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Alright sorry folks but I was just putting my opinion. At no point did I mean to be disrespectful to anyone if someone thinks I have been. Didn't mean to hijack thread either (apologies Dr. Pink). I can understand that other people have different views on alcohol (duh), again I was just putting my opinion.

 

I'm not going to hold back on my opinions and views just because they could be perceived to 'give vegans a bad reputation' by some. That's censorship. If people stereotype vegans that's their problem, not ours. Editing our own views so that they don't 'threaten' the concept of veganism is just more stereotyping but in the other direction!! Respectful free speech ftw.

 

So because I don't drink I'm an awkward, sociopathic weirdo?

 

I've got no problem with other people drinking and I'm not trying to enforce on people that they shouldn't. I was just genuinely curious about why many people here (who so clearly care a great deal about their health) will willingly drink poison. (Let's not forget that's what it is)

 

Anyway I'm off to have some steroids now, but it's ok because I only use them in moderation. (jokes)

 

EDIT: Page for you Pink: http://www.veggiewines.co.uk/

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The problem is that this topic wasn't meant to be about the ethics of alcohol. It isn't censorship to say that what's been said in this topic shouldn't be in here - nobody is saying that views should not be expressed, just what has it got to do with this thread? I don't generally care if a topic goes slightly off topic, but this thread was barely ever on topic, it went straight off topic and onto another one, and there wasn't really a need for it. But it went off topic long before you posted (RobertSupreme), and I can understand the attraction to put in a point of view once other points have been raised.

 

I don't understand why this thread got off topic in the first place. Was the idea to put Pink off drinking? If so, the way it was done was never going to work, it seemed more like certain posters just wanted to stir things up which is totally unnecessary, that's how it looks to me - and I am strongly anti-alcohol as it is. I don't feel the need to slam alcohol in a thread just because the word "alcohol" is used. I could understand the reaction if the thread had instead been entitled "Alcohol is great, there are no problems associated with it" - then I would have posted too saying that's BS. But that's just not the case with this thread.

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I don't see how anyone could perceive anything in this thread as being akin to only Vegans. These are opinions of, and counter-opinions of, millions of people in all walks of life. If someone were to attribute these opinions to only vegans well these people are already biased in their views, and will attribute anything they perceive negitive to be associated to Veganism.

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Alcohol is useless: empty calories; as well as potentially harmful(and technically always harmlful, on the neurotic system and the liver). Should we open a new thread to discuss this ? Maybe, but expressing our opinions on the bad side of alcohol is not so "off-topic" in a thread for discussing which alcohols are vegan. Many people talked about good sides of alcohol and why they like it, this is "off-topic" too.

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Eh. I'm done with alcohol. Decided to try out some vodka( Took advice and went with Smirnoff ) and got drunk off of it. I think my mistake was when I mixed it with soymilk. . I digress.

 

I'm not giving up alcohol. IYM does have a good point. The statement is even truer when it comes to hard liquor.

 

But I think alcohol has a place. Like all things have a place. Sure drinking loads of Vodka and getting shit faced like I did is a terrible idea. But there's nothing wrong with a nice glass of wine every night with dinner. It's great for the blood. And makes you look sophisticated. .

 

I'm not pushing any kind of religion with this next statement. Just using it as an example for alcohol. They drank wine at the last supper. Did they not? If alcohol was a bad, sinful thing I'm sure it wouldn't have been included.

 

So, anyways. Is there even any such thing as high quality, Vegan and Organic wine?

A nice glass of wine and a heaping plate of Spaghetti along with a few slices of bread( Or a whole roll ) really does sound like a nice night. Just you, your food, your drink, and a little Depeche Mode.

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I wasn't going to say anything else, but I can't help myself. Someone said that if you drink how could you have enough willpower to be vegan? Well when you drink or do any other "vice" for that matter you are making a personal decision about how to treat YOUR body. Where as being vegan is about not mistreating another beings body. I think that is the main difference. Also, in moderation, most "vices" can be a very fun experience. It's those with no self control that ruin it for everyone else.

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Good point veganjons75.

 

That would of been me that made that oversight on why most people are Vegan, because the no.1 reason I'm Vegan and Veganism to me is because/about not eating certain foods for health reasons.

 

With what you say in mind, I'm still confused as to why people who care so much about not mistreating other beings would continue to mistreat themselves.

 

Drinking alcohol as a form of 'mistreatment' is obviously subjective because there are many people who regard it as the opposite - a treat. It's just that I personally can not see how drinking poison can in any way be beneficial. Aside from creating an aura of sophistication.

 

Also I think that part of the problem with those who take it too far isn't that they just don't have self control, it's that this lack of self control has developed over time as a result of drinking an addictive drug substance. I'd bet the majority of alcoholics didn't just suddenly turn that way overnight but started off with the odd drink now and again. (Obviously this does not mean that I am implying an individual could not maintain a sensible level of alcohol consumption his whole life becuase there are obviously people who do).

 

Just a thought.

 

EDIT: Obviously Mr. Pink and everyone else at the end of the day makes their own decisions about what they drink or not and in no way am I trying to change anybody's opinion on the matter or anything like that (before I get flamed )

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Drinking alcohol as a form of 'mistreatment' is obviously subjective because there are many people who regard it as the opposite - a treat. It's just that I personally can not see how drinking poison can in any way be beneficial. Aside from creating an aura of sophistication.

 

Not a flame by any means, just a thought regarding the way you perceive drinking.

 

While you may consider it to be poisoning the body to have a drink or two, it's also poisonous to choose to live in a big city with plenty of pollution, to consume caffeine, and it may possibly be hurting us every time we use a cell phone. There are a lot of ways we could ideally pick and choose to avoid things that we know aren't "good" for us, but yet, we all have things that we refuse to give up which are, in some way or other, slowly doing damage to our bodies. Of course, going on a blackout drinking bender every few days or even every few weeks isn't a good idea at all, but truthfully, what is worse - having two beers once per week, or, breathing in toxic junk like carbon monoxide and other airborne pollutants daily while walking through the streets of a large congested city? Most of us accept some degree of risk in our choice of lifestyle, and if you're going to do so, it may as well be for something you find pleasurable vs. something that's an irritation just to think about.

 

I try to look at my body as a temple, but that doesn't mean that services aren't suspended for a private party from time to time

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