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Would you date a hermaphrodite?


Richard
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That's interesting Kath, I hadn't heard of anything like that before.

 

I feel kind of bad for hermaphrodites, because not only is it difficult to live with it anyway, it's also hard to have a relationship with anybody, because so many people are likely to turn them down based entirely on this factor.

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I generally go for very masculine type "A" men. Very goal oriented, strong, and forward. I'm not sure a hermaphrodite would ever fit this. It would be quite a surprise

Masculinity and Type A behavior are cultural (gender), not biological (sex). A person isn't born Type A, which is a good thing because Type A personality is considered a risk factor for illness -- both physical and psychological -- such as being coronary-prone. Being a hermaphrodite (or intersex) person is biological (sex), not cultural (gender). So a person can be intersex and Type A personality. There are plenty of people who don't identify as "men" but would fit Typa A behavior.

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I generally go for very masculine type "A" men. Very goal oriented, strong, and forward. I'm not sure a hermaphrodite would ever fit this. It would be quite a surprise

Masculinity and Type A behavior are cultural (gender), not biological (sex). A person isn't born Type A, which is a good thing because Type A personality is considered a risk factor for illness -- both physical and psychological -- such as being coronary-prone. Being a hermaphrodite (or intersex) person is biological (sex), not cultural (gender). So a person can be intersex and Type A personality. There are plenty of people who don't identify as "men" but would fit Typa A behavior.

 

Very interesting Daniel, thanks.

 

When I said strong, I should clarify "strong" as in strength not personality and again quite masculine.

 

I know a lot of boys growing up who were very protective types and could be confrontational if challenged. I wonder how much of that is behavioral and how much is genetic predisposition. Genetic vs behvioral is an interesting topic such as a mass murderer who was raised in a normal family where everyone else turn out OK. I remember a deviant crimes class where this was brought up many times and is being studied. But, I'm going on a tangent again

 

Not knowing much about hermaphrodites I don't know whether they would or would not fit this type of person. I may know someone who is, maybe there is someone on our forum reading this now who is a hermaphrodite. I really don't think finding this out about someone I know would change how I felt about the person.

 

On the other hand, If faced with a permanent relationship with someone. Your future would come into play, children and such. I don't know how this would effect that.

 

I would still go back to my original answer, I really don't know unless faced with it.

 

Wow, this dating thing is so taxing, how do you all do it?!?

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Lol! This thread is hilarious!

 

Jay, I'm disappointed in you! Why would something so superficial as fake breasts keep you from caring about a soul?? I mean, I'm shocked! You'd allow one aspect of someone's appearance to make or break your decision?

I'd date a man with a fake penis...I mean, really...does one's genitalia define them?

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Lol! This thread is hilarious!

 

Jay, I'm disappointed in you! Why would something so superficial as fake breasts keep you from caring about a soul?? I mean, I'm shocked! You'd allow one aspect of someone's appearance to make or break your decision?

I'd date a man with a fake penis...I mean, really...does one's genitalia define them?

I wasn't talking about a women who had a masectomy. I just meant people in general who care too much about appearances. I wouldn't want to date someone who cared so much about the size of their breasts that they got fake breasts to go from an A to C cup or whatever. The idea that you've got to have huge sexual organs and that it's so important someone would be willing to risk their health and stuff silicon into their body kind of freaks me out.

 

Would you date a man with a toupee and who had a silicone sheath put into his chest to make himself look stronger and who had his 5 inch penis augmented to 10? I think you wouldn't for what it would say about his mind. If he had no penis or virtually no penis then I guess a fake penis would be understandable.

 

Even toupees (sp) are really bothersome to me. Who the person actually is, is what matters; how horrible that they feel the need to hide their natural appearance. But I can understand in situations where they have suffered some kind of serious illness/injury and just want to fit in.

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I know a lot of boys growing up who were very protective types and could be confrontational if challenged. I wonder how much of that is behavioral and how much is genetic predisposition. Genetic vs behvioral is an interesting topic such as a mass murderer who was raised in a normal family where everyone else turn out OK. I remember a deviant crimes class where this was brought up many times and is being studied. But, I'm going on a tangent again

As a society, we tend to overstate the role of genetics. This is a shame, because such fatalistic reasoning supports the status quo and stands in the way of social change. It is very common for people to off-handedly make references to biological determinism in everyday saying, e.g. Boy will be boys. I am not saying genetics have no role, but culture is more significant. Yet, if any degree of biology is present -- no matter how small -- it is generally extravagated to the exclusion of all cultural factors.

 

Take, for example, the sex difference in strength. Do males have a predisposition for muscle mass and strength? Perhaps so, but what is a predisposition? It is a possibility; something that is possible given the existence of other factors. Being male will not determine -- that is make -- a person strong and massive. Strength is something that must be trained -- just as our society trains boys to aggressive. A female who trains will be comparatively stronger than a male who does not. (There is a myth that women can't be strong, while ignoring the fact that most men do not train and are relatively weak.)

 

Thus, the concept of a person who is a natural born killer, so to speak, is a cop-out. (This past weekend I was at a seminar where a person who worked in mental health made the point that people with mental illness are no more dangerous than mentally healthy people. The minority who are violent -- healthy or not -- are "assholes" who have developed a certain personality.)

 

It's not our biology that is important, so much as what we do with it. If we can get over the idea that being male or female dictates who we are and what we can do, then we will have far greater freedom to live conscious lives, while work towards a more egalitarian society. Like considering the possibility of dating an intersex person, I think it is healthy to look for roads undefined by restrictive sex roles. If being male means being aggressive, and being female means being passive, then I'll choose a neuter (non-gender defined) route by striving to be assertive.

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may i add that i haven't thought extensively on this subject either. still, as i've explored sexuality in my adult life, i've determined that very little phases me and highly doubt that this would influence me given that the other fundamentals of what i'd consider a strong relationship were present.

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who had his 5 inch penis augmented to 10?

 

Stay away! Stay very far away (is this even appealing to women, except in male fantasies?)

 

I'm right with you on being turned off by "cosmetic surgery" (not "reconstructive surgery"). I'm amazed at how many women on some fitness boards I'm on have had breast implants. FITNESS and "major surgery to 'correct' something that isn't even 'defective"" just don't go together in my book. Even worse, perhaps, are the video exercise instructors (I work out at home) who get implants. Karen Voight is a very respected iinstructor, but she lost some of my respect (and I couldn't workout "with her" for a while) when she went from her natuaral "A-cup" to a "D' cup.

 

As for shallowness, who is MORE shallow, someone who prefers not to go out with someone with fake breasts, or someone who somehow feels they need fake breasts?

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As for shallowness, who is MORE shallow, someone who prefers not to go out with someone with fake breasts, or someone who somehow feels they need fake breasts?

 

I don't think it's a deciding factor. I think it is generally going to be linked with other aspects of behaviour, but not necessarily. A very very shallow person who is obsessed with appearances etc might have cosmetic surgery. It's the fact that they're obsessed with appearances that irritates me, not the cosmetic surgery as such, although that is also a waste of time etc. If a person is generally not that shallow, but has had some cosmetic surgery, then they're not written off to me, it all depends on their reasoning and what type of person they are. They might even regret having it done or whatever. I don't know what Jay would say.

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It doesn't bother me if people have plastic surgery. To me it's all the same as having tattoos, piercings, etc.

 

Yeah I feel kind of the same about it like that. But in the same way, tattoos, piercings, make-up, fashion etc it's all to do with physical appearance. A person isn't necessarily 100% shallow because they do those things, I wouldn't judge someone for doing those things. However, it is often linked with a more deep shallowness, from what I've experienced, and it's that shallowness which bugs me, not those individual acts. Primarily, if a person is judging other people based on appearance, I have a big problem with that. But you can take interest in your own appearance without judging other people, it's not always hand in hand like that, but it often is.

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Well people make mistakes. Maybe someone is unhappy and they convince themselves that bigger breasts will turn their life around! I knew a very nice girl who convinced herself that because she naturally carried fat on her hips she need liposuction for her hips. She wasn't very shallow, just thought it would make her feel better about herself. People grasp on to things like that occasionally who aren't really that shallow.

 

So it's too much of a blanket statement I guess on my part. And I was only talking about dating. I'd still consider someone with cosmetic surgery as a friend of course. I'd just be really cautious about having them as my closest companion for the rest of my life. Of course I'd be cautious on that no matter what anyway.

 

I'm married and very happy with that by the way.

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Thanks for that, Jay, I knew that was what you thought; you know me -- I just had to call you on it

And I agree with you to an extent; but it's just that one cannot know another's intent/purpose by looking at them

 

From my experience this subject could get really ugly; but I'll refrain from responding to some of the comments as I know robert has expressed his desire to keep this forum friendly and non-argumentative.

However, suffice it to say, it never ceases to sadden me the irony and pettiness one comes across from time to time in this subject.

 

I think Richard's very clear, fair, and balanced on the subject .

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As for shallowness, who is MORE shallow, someone who prefers not to go out with someone with fake breasts, or someone who somehow feels they need fake breasts?

Is this the right question? I don't feel that shallowness really address the desire to have fake breasts, or the desire to date a person with fake breasts. I think reasons why a person desires unnatural breasts goes deeper than that. I think a better question, one that would provide us with more understanding, would be to ask if this is an informed desire or a deformed desire. I believe it is the latter.

 

To say someone is shallow puts all the blame on the individual. As if it were a failure of character. Informed and deformed acknowledges that the person's desires have a relation to other individuals and society as a whole.

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That's still too simplistic and highly judgmental. I think judging someone on physical attributes is disturbing and says more about the person judging than the judged.

 

"I won't date someone with fake breasts"

vs.

"I won't date someone flat chested"

 

what's the difference? None.

 

And assuming to know someone's reasons for anything, really, just by looking at them is presumptuous at best.

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That's still too simplistic and highly judgmental. I think judging someone on physical attributes is disturbing and says more about the person judging than the judged.

 

"I won't date someone with fake breasts"

vs.

"I won't date someone flat chested"

 

what's the difference? None.

 

And assuming to know someone's reasons for anything, really, just by looking at them is presumptuous at best.

I won't assume you're replying to my post, because your judgment is nothing close to what I stated.

 

What are you referring to? What is "still too simplistic and highly judgmental"? Who exactly are you referring to? Who is judging people on physical attributes? Who is assuming to know someone's reasons just by looking at them? What is this flat vs fake thing? Where is this dating dualism come from?

 

Sorry, but since your post come right after mine, it does feel like you are replying to what I wrote. If you are replying to me, I feel I should point out that the reply makes no senses too me. I see no context justifying the assumptions and judgments that are being made in the reply.

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I think a better question, one that would provide us with more understanding, would be to ask if this is an informed desire or a deformed desire. I believe it is the latter.

 

Ummm...this is not a judgment? Lol. "I believe it is the latter" is not a conclusion? On what do you base this judgment?

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That's an awesome sig, raVen.

 

Anyway, I don't think much good will come of this here.... I'm sorry for my original comment about fake breasts. I'm sure if the person was an ethical vegan that would negate anything negative their fake breasts might suggest.

 

This is a little like the 500 dollar watch thread.... I really don't make much at all about appearances and like I couldn't even tell a 500 dollar watch and never even look at a person's watch I can't tell fake breasts and I don't like stare or anything.....

 

And the informed/deformed thing is a nice sentiment but "deformed" maybe has negative connotations I guess...?

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I think a better question, one that would provide us with more understanding, would be to ask if this is an informed desire or a deformed desire. I believe it is the latter.

Ummm...this is not a judgment? Lol. "I believe it is the latter" is not a conclusion? On what do you base this judgment?

It is a judgment, but I never said it wasn't. I made a judgment about the social matrix, not a judgment of the any individual. You were saying I was judging a person, I was not. In fact, my point was the judging the person is misguided: "To say someone is shallow puts all the blame on the individual. As if it were a failure of character." The point was that I'm against that.

 

I didn't write anything about judging someone on physical attributes. I never wrote anything about not dating a person with fake breasts, or a flat chest. And no, I don't see an apparent reason why not dating one person is different not dating the other. Nor do I assume to know someone's reasons for anything just by looking at them. Those are all assumptions that where made about what I wrote that are not supported by anything I wrote.

 

I feel wrongly judged because of the assumptions that where made in your original reply, _raVen_. You can answer the questions in my previous post, and maybe I'll be able understand the reasons for your reply? I'm not going to assume the reasons for judging what I wrote. If you feel it is disturbing for a person judge another, maybe you can enlighten me about the judgments and assumptions you made about me?

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