2 months into living vegan and still havent dropped lbs!!!=(

[Zack]

 

Yup, really. Water does not require mechanical or chemical breakdown, so no digestion.

 

why not?

 

Volume is how much space it takes up. When you blend a piece of fruit, you release the water from that fruit. The water is absorbed quickly when you consume it. If it is still in the fiber, it requires more digestion to release it and will maintain the volume of the fiber until it is released.

 

but what about when you chew and the fiber gets smashed apart, doesn't the water come out?

[xjohanx]

Fruit is awesome.

 

This! and Ducati actually has a point. When comparing satiety between a food blended or intact the intact one always wins. This has been done on apple and products of apple (fiber enriched juice, regular juice, apple slices or apple sauce) and the result is pretty conclusive. Having a smoothie is not unhealthy really but during a weight loss it's much better to chew yourself. Chewing should be a part of a healthy meal.

 

Um...I have fruit smoothies fairly regularly and have succeeded in losing weight--and my metabolism is crap. I don't get the fruit-phobia, guys.

 

This is sort of a strawman argument. No one is saying you can't lose weight with smoothies. Whole intact food just gives you a better satiety which is something you'd want during a diet.

[apriltrainer]

I eat fruit with every main meal and snack. Like someone said..eat it whole. I usually don't blend it . I just need that crunch to feel full. Am not a big smoothie, juice person. Once in a while. But mainly I'll have my fruit whole.

Don't feel bad though..after I gained wt with my pregnancy and then went through a divorce which caused me to gain more wt...I trained to run a whole marathon! I didn't lose one pound. Didn't gain any. Didn't lose any either though. (I used to be 180 by the way )

 

I realized I was overeating my training,even if my training was more than most people. Just because I was training for a marathon didn't mean I had the green light to eat all you can eat pancakes!

 

Maybe same thing for the vegan life. If it's vegan it must be all healthy right? Not true. I bought a vegan buffalo tofu wrap at this store on campus where I work. Reading the nutrition info in very small print- this one sandwich is actually two servings! 620 calories for the whole thing.

 

I promptly cut that sucker in half and ate my apple with it.

 

 

I see the young women at this school buy this all the time and eating it like it's one serving. They are probably gaining wt and wondering why ,if they are buying vegan products. Portion sizes. That will help you too. I get a small dinner plate and fill half with veggies, a quarter with my protein and the other quarter with fruit.

 

A little hard when you are eating food that combines all of that, like a sandwich but if you are home, try to do that. It helped me out.

Edited June 25, 2010 by apriltrainer

[BlueRose]

Diet alone will never make you lose weight. Only way to drop weight is to increase metabolism through exercise and eat enough to sustain you during your workouts.

 

I speak from personal experience. I used to eat under 1k calories per day and wonder why I had problems with weight gain let alone maintaining my weight. Body goes into starvation mode and will store all food as fat. Consequently a lot of people's problems isn't just what they're eating but not eating enough. I now eat 1500-1600 calories per day and am thinner and healthier than I have been in ages, and if you don't believe me go look at my pics in my log.

[Ducati]

Diet alone will never make you lose weight. Only way to drop weight is to increase metabolism through exercise and eat enough to sustain you during your workouts.

 

I speak from personal experience. I used to eat under 1k calories per day and wonder why I had problems with weight gain let alone maintaining my weight. Body goes into starvation mode and will store all food as fat. Consequently a lot of people's problems isn't just what they're eating but not eating enough. I now eat 1500-1600 calories per day and am thinner and healthier than I have been in ages, and if you don't believe me go look at my pics in my log.

 

Blue Rose,

 

I used to exercise like crazy trying to keep from getting bigger and bigger. When I went vegan (Junk food), I lost around 40 pounds over several months and stopped working out. When I did 100% raw fruits and vegetables for 1 month, I lost at least 20 pounds in the first month. I didn't start exercising until after I lost the weight. I also wasn't restricting calories. I was eating the same number of calories or even more, but they were 80-90% carbs.

 

Many people here will say that you need to eat less calories than you burn to lose weight. This is not correct. All calories are not equal. You can actually eat more calories and lose weight if they are the right calories. When you eat a lot of fruits and vegetables, you are consuming a great deal of fiber. Fiber has calories, but our bodies have a very difficult time digesting fiber. This means your body will not be able to used those calories.

 

Also, your body treats calories differently. If you consume fat, your body would rather store it than burn it. If you consume carbs, your body would rather burn it than store it. If you consume protein, your body would rather use it to build and repair then store or burn it.

 

Although your body can burn all three for energy, it would rather use carbs because they are the easiest to burn. Fat is the hardest to burn. Many people say that working out hungry means you will just burn fat. However, fat needs to be burned with carbs and working out hungry likely means you are burning muscle. Think of fat as a big log in a campfire and carbs as little logs. The little logs are easier to get started and once they are burning, you can throw on the big logs.

 

And as you found out, restricting calories too much has a detrimental effect. Your body slows down to cope with the reduction of calories.

 

My total weight loss was over 80 pounds and around 70 pounds of that was done without exercise.

[beforewisdom]

Many people here will say that you need to eat less calories than you burn to lose weight. This is not correct. All calories are not equal.

 

I've heard the exact opposite from every expert with a degree.

 

There is a grain of truth in that if someone does some precarious balance of nutrients they might be able to consume a negligible amount more, like 50 calories.

 

Otherwise, it is energy in versus energy out.

 

I don't think most people are aware of how many calories they eat. It is like spending money without balancing a checkbook. You just don't know until you right it down.

 

I think people who eat high bulk diets get the mistaken impression that they are eating more calories when they are actually eating less. They are just eating a higher volume and weight of food.

[Ducati]

 

I've heard the exact opposite from every expert with a degree.

 

An expert is just someone indoctrinated to a particular way of thinking, and a degree just lets you know what indoctrination was used.

 

2/3's of the United States are overweight and 1/3 is obese despite listening to thousands of "experts".

 

You can restrict calories and still gain weight. Your carb intake is what sets your metabolism. Reduce your carbs and your metabolism decreases. If you are consuming a lot of fat, your body thinks there is a scarcity of plentiful foods and starts to store the fat. I did this for years. The more I restricted my diet, the fatter I got. Now I eat all I want of the right foods, and I lose weight.

 

I consume anywhere from 80 - 200 grams of fiber a day. That equates to 320 to 800 calories that my body won't digest.

[beforewisdom]

An expert is just someone indoctrinated to a particular way of thinking, and a degree just lets you know what indoctrination was used

 

There are subcultures in fields and institutions, but I wouldn't go much further than that.

 

When you car breaks do you go to a mechanic? If you broke your leg would you go to a doctor? If your pipes don't work would you call a plumber?

 

Why pay those fees if those experts are just like anyone else aside from indoctrination into a subculture?

 

You pay those people because they know things that you do not.

[Ducati]

An expert is just someone indoctrinated to a particular way of thinking, and a degree just lets you know what indoctrination was used

 

There are subcultures in fields and institutions, but I wouldn't go much further than that.

 

When you car breaks do you go to a mechanic? If you broke your leg would you go to a doctor? If your pipes don't work would you call a plumber?

 

Why pay those fees if those experts are just like anyone else aside from indoctrination into a subculture?

 

You pay those people because they know things that you do not.

 

Knowing something I do not does not make them an expert. When someone claims to be an expert, they assume they know everything and they shut themselves off to other possibilities. I am very suspicious of anyone who claims to be an expert in anything.

[Fallen_Horse]

You can restrict calories and still gain weight. Your carb intake is what sets your metabolism. Reduce your carbs and your metabolism decreases.

No

[Ducati]

You can restrict calories and still gain weight. Your carb intake is what sets your metabolism. Reduce your carbs and your metabolism decreases.

No

 

Excellent argument.

[chrisjs]

When you guys are done making stuff up perhaps you can find time to read some actual studies.

 

Postprandial thermogenesis is increased 100% on a high-protein, low-fat diet versus a high-carbohydrate, low-fat diet in healthy, young women.

Johnston CS, Day CS, Swan PD.J Am Coll Nutr. 2002 Feb;21(1):55-61.

 

OBJECTIVE: The recent literature suggests that high-protein, low-fat diets promote a greater degree of weight loss compared to high-carbohydrate, low-fat diets, but the mechanism of this enhanced weight loss is unclear. This study compared the acute, energy-cost of meal-induced thermogenesis on a high-protein, low-fat diet versus a high-carbohydrate, low-fat diet....

CONCLUSIONS: These data indicate an added energy-cost associated with high-protein, low-fat diets and may help explain the efficacy of such diets for weight loss.

Presence or absence of carbohydrates and the proportion of fat in a high-protein diet affect appetite suppression but not energy expenditure in normal-weight human subjects fed in energy balance.

Veldhorst MA, Westerterp KR, van Vught AJ, Westerterp-Plantenga MS. Br J Nutr. 2010 Jun 22:1-11.

 

Two types of relatively high-protein diets, with a normal or low proportion of carbohydrates, have been shown effective for weight loss. The objective was to assess the significance of the presence or absence of carbohydrates and the proportion of fat in high-protein diets for affecting appetite suppression, energy expenditure, and fat oxidation in normal-weight subjects in energy balance.... In conclusion, appetite suppression and fat oxidation were higher on a high-protein diet without than with carbohydrates exchanged for fat. Energy expenditure was not affected by the carbohydrate content of a high-protein diet.

[Ducati]

Chris,

 

Those abstracts don't reveal much information on the study.

 

One reason high protein diet appear to work is that many people eat large quantities of highly processed crap food. HFCS and other sugar like junk is used in extremely high quantities in many foods today. If someone is eating a lot of this junk food, then they have sugar and insulin spikes that increase cravings. If they eat more protein, then they are consuming less "empty" carb calories.

 

Like I said before, not all calories are created equal.

[Im Your Man]

Postprandial thermogenesis is increased 100% on a high-protein, low-fat diet versus a high-carbohydrate, low-fat diet in healthy, young women.

Johnston CS, Day CS, Swan PD.

What's a high-protein, low-fat and low-carb diet?... some egg whites, chicken breasts, protein powders and nothing else ? lol

 

 

Fruits are not even that good for losing weight. One or two before training, that's all I can think.

 

I lost 10 pounds of fat this month by eating almost only fruits. You will lose much more weight by eating fruits compared to eating bagels, pastas or chicken wings... I just finished eating half a watermelon, it is about 800 calories, 165 grams of sugar, 18 grams protein, 350% DV for Vitamin A and C...

[Ducati]

What's a high-protein, low-fat and low-carb diet?... some egg whites, chicken breasts, protein powders and nothing else ? lol

 

Many people consider anything less than 30% fat to be low fat. But without reading the study, it is hard to say what they consider low fat.

 

I never lost any significant amount of weight that I didn't put right back on until I started eating raw fruits and veggies as the main portions of my diet. Then, it just melted right off:)

[Im Your Man]

Me too; lots of raw veggies and fruits is the key to losing weight for me and to maintain an healthy diet, otherwise when I start eating lots of rice and cooked food I can't get enough or I feel as if I miss something. Either I eat lots of fruits and veggies or I end up eating chocolate, chips and cookies and I gain weight...

[medman]

This thread cracks me up, especially with all the bickering over macronutrient ratios when the original poster, who was complaining of trouble losing weight, did the math and figured out she was eating like 4,000 calories a day. She was totally right to cut that down, a 4000 calorie diet certainly does not promote weight loss!

 

An expert is just someone indoctrinated to a particular way of thinking, and a degree just lets you know what indoctrination was used.

 

2/3's of the United States are overweight and 1/3 is obese despite listening to thousands of "experts".

 

Actually, those people DON'T listen to experts. The millions upon millions of overweight and obese Americans eating McDonald's and funions can attest to that. Considering any health expert of any sort would say regular exercise is a crucial part of weight loss, and so few people actually exercise at all, should give you an idea of how closely the average American is following the advice of any given health expert.

 

Also, "indoctrinated" is one of those convenient terms that people throw around in order to try to put their opinions on equal footing with evidence-backed arguments. For example, I know the chemtrails in the sky are being used to keep the masses docile and obedient, and any aviation "expert" who says they're vapour trails is just indoctrinated by the underhanded work of the illuminati. See?

[Ducati]

Medman,

 

Show me the evidence that Americans are not listening to the "experts".

[beforewisdom]

Medman,

 

Show me the evidence that Americans are not listening to the "experts".

 

You are claiming to have more knowledge than people who have completed formal studies and you are asking for evidence.

 

I'm not Medman, but I have two examples of "Americans not listening to the experts"

 

Low carb zealots frequently state that "people listened to the experts to eat low fat and got fatter". Not true. Here is an excerpt from The China study that clearly shows that most Americans did not listen to the "experts"

 

(from page 95 of The China Study )

One of the fundamental arguments at the beginning of most low carbohydrate, high-protein diet books is that America has been wallowing in low-fat mania at the advice of experts for the past twenty years, but there is one inconvenient fact that is consistently ignored: according to a report summarizing government food statistics, “Americans consumed thirteen pounds more fats and oils per person in 1997 than in 1970, up from 52.6 to 65.6 pounds.” It is true that we have had a trend toward consuming fewer of our total calories as fat, when considered as a percentage, but that’s only because we have outpaced our gorging on fat by gorging on sugary junk food. Simply by looking at the numbers, anybody can see that America has not adopted the “low-fat” experiment– not by an stretch of the imagination.

 

 

In other words, Americans as a whole, were never on a low fat diet. Americans are fatter now because Americans have been eating more calories overall. Again, nothing new. You can read the same information in more detail in the August 2004 edition of The National Geographic (pages 46 – 61), “Why are Americans so fat” by Cathy Newman.

 

"Experts" have been telling Americans to reduce calories and fat. Something they have not done.

 

These are 2 examples of "Americans not listening to experts".

[medman]

Medman,

 

Show me the evidence that Americans are not listening to the "experts".

 

Beforewisdom did an excellent job of giving an example. But, here's a quick stat from the CDC (centre for disease control) in the US:

 

Percent of adults who engaged in regular leisure-time physical activity: 32.5%

Percent of adults who engaged in no leisure-time physical activity: 36%

 

That's just a quick, small statistic showing how inactive most Americans are. Engaging in physical activity is one of the most basic premises of healthy living. The thing I don't understand is that you seem to be assuming that the average American is making an effort to lose weight/be healthy, but that they've been somehow misled by the people giving them health advice. The reality is that only a minority of people actually put effort into balancing their diet and exercising.

 

But more importantly, I want to point out something I find really irksome. Why is it that people making non-evidence-based claims always put the responsibility of producing statistics on those they're arguing against? Let's see you produce statistics to prove that Americans are putting in sincere effort into losing weight, but are being unsuccessful because the macronutrient ratio recommended to them has prevented that, and not because they're eating Dairy Queen and playing World of Warcraft all day.

[xjohanx]

This thread really sucks.

[Ducati]

I don't claim to have more knowledge, I just don't take anything at face value.

 

What experts aren't they listening to? Would those be experts on the 10 Superfoods Cookbook , 100 Calorie Diet, 12 Steps to Raw Foods, 1200 Calorie Diet , 1500 Calorie Diet Cookbook, 21 Day Detox, 21 Day Diet, 21 Pounds in 21 Days, 3 Apple a Day Diet, 3 Day Diet , 3 Hour Diet , 321 Baby Bulge Be Gone, 4 Day Diet , 4 Week Detox Diet, 400 Calorie Fix Diet, 5 Day Miracle Diet, 5 Factor Diet, 5 Factor World Diet, 6 Day Body Makeover , 6 Week Body Makeover , 7 Day Diet , 7 Secrets to Beauty, Health, and Longevity, 18 Pounds in 4 Days , 80 10 10 Diet, Abs Diet , Acai Berry Diet , Acid-Alkaline Diets, Acne Diet, ADHD Diet, Ali Vincent Diet, Alpha Male Challenge, Alternate Day Diet, Anabolic Diet , Anne Collins Weight Loss Program, Anti-Aging Diet, Anti Estrogenic Diet , 3 Apple a Day Diet, Apple Cider Vinegar Diet , Arthritis Diet , Atkins Diet, Banana Diet , Beck Diet , Bernstein Diet, Best Diet For Me, Best Life Diet , Beverly Hills Diet , New Beverly Hills Diet , Beyond The 120 Year Diet, Big Breakfast Diet, Biggest Loser Club , Bikini Bootcamp, Binge Eating and Compulsive Overeating, Birchall Diet, Bistro MD, Blood Type Diet , Blue Zones, Body Ecology Diet , Body for Life , Body Building Diet, Bodytrim Diet , Bonus Years Diet: FoodsFor Longevity, Brazilian Bikini Body Program , Bread for Life Diet , Breast Cancer Diet, Bridal Bootcamp, British Heart Foundation Diet , Brown Fat Revolution Diet, Cabbage Soup Diet , Calorie Restriction , Cambridge Diet , Cancer Diet, Candida, Carbohydrate Addicts , Cardio Free Diet , Change One (Reader's Digest), The Cheater's Diet , Children's Diet Programs, Chocolate Diet , Cholesterol Lowering Diet , The Clean Diet, Coconut Diet , Cookie Diet, Cook Yourself Thin Cookbook, Core Balance Diet, CSIRO Diet , Cure for Diabetes, Curves Diet, DASH Diet , Delivered Diets , Detox Diets, Detox For Women, Diabetes DTOUR Diet, Diabetic Diet, Diet Denominator, Diet Divas, Diet Joke , Diet Selector, Diet Smart , The Diet Solution, DietWatch, Diet to Go Review, Diuretics and Diet , Diverticulitis Diet , Doctor's Orders, The Dorm Room Diet , Dr Amanda's Don't Go Hungry Diet, Dr Bernstein Diet, Dr Feingold Diet , Dr Kushner's Diet (personality diet), Dr Seigals Cookie Diet, Dukan Diet, Duke Diet , Easy Macrobiotic Diet, Eat Clean Diet, Eat Clean Diet Recharged, Eating for Life, Eat, Drink, Be Healthy , Eating for Beauty, Eat Like a Hot Chick, Eat For Health, Eating Mindfully , Eat, Shrink and Be Merry, Eat Smart: The Zen Anti-Diet, Eat Stop Eat: 24 Hour Fast, Eat This, Not That , Eat to Live , Eat What You Love, Love What You Eat, Eat Your Way to Happiness, eDiets, eDiets Fresh Prepared Meal Delivery, Egg Diet , Elimination Diets , Every Other Day Diet , F-Factor Diet , F-Plan Diet, Facial Analysis Diet, Fad Diets, Family Fit Diet, Fast Food Diet , Fat Burning Bible, Fat Burning Diet , Fast Track Detox Diet , Fat Flush Diet, Fat Flush for Life, Fat Loss 4 Idiots, Fat Loss Factor Diet Plan, Fat Loss Target , Fat Resistance Diet , Fat Smash Diet, Feingold Diet, Fit Not Fat at 40-Plus, Flat Belly Diet , Flavor Point Diet , Food Doctor Diet, Food Guide Pyramid (1992), Food Guide Pyramid - 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There is an expert on everyone one of these diets. Which one are Americans suppose to listen to, and which ones are they suppose to ignore?

 

When I used to own a TV, I saw many diet pills promoting weight loss without exercise. That is pretty bad nutrition advice. Many people consider someone selling a diet pill to be an "expert". They often claim it was developed by Doctors.

 

Worse yet, they watch shows like "The Biggest Loser" which show you need to perform extreme workouts to lose weight and they resign.

 

There are plenty of "experts" and their opinions are are just that, opinions. Nutrition is so complex that most studies performed on nutrition are worthless. You have to read the study and analyze their data taking to determine if there is any worth to the study. I read excerpts to new studies rather frequently that claims vegans or vegetarians are unhealthy and that people should eat plenty of meat and dairy.

 

I put my food intake into the FDA's website and it told me to eat fewer carbs and more fat. I should listen to them why? I already listen to them growing up and was overweight or obese for 32 years of my life because I followed the FDA's guidelines.

 

So, which "experts" should everyone listen to?

[Ducati]

I figured out who we should listen to! We should ask our Surgeon General about weight loss and healthy living:)

 

http://www.surgeongeneral.gov/images_sg/rmbenjamin.jpg

[Zack]

So, which "experts" should everyone listen to?

 

The ones that say that when you eat under your maintenance calorie levels, you will lose weight.

[beforewisdom]

I don't claim to have more knowledge, I just don't take anything at face value.

 

What experts aren't they listening to? Would those be experts on the 10 Superfoods Cookbook ,

 

I got the impression from reading your posts in this thread that you claimed that a diet that worked for you is how things really work, versus what medical authorities state that it is all about taking in less calories than is used.. You were claiming to have knowledge that those educated experts did not.

 

Now you are claiming you are not claiming to know something they do not.

 

Now you are also claiming that you don't take anything at face value, but that is completely what accepting popular explanations or your own explanation about your anecdotal account is.

 

Lastly, I, as I'm sure others have, I had the strong impression that you were referring to legitimate medical, scientific, health and fitness authorities as "experts" who Americans were listening to, but still staying fat.

 

However, after people contradicted you on that statement with hard proof, that indeed Americans are not taking expert advice, you changed your definition of "experts" to point to quack diet book authors instead.