compassionategirl Posted February 20, 2006 Share Posted February 20, 2006 People here have been immensely patient with her, repeatedly explaining the blantantly obvious and giving her 2nd, 3rd, 4th, nth chances. So please can people not attact the members that have been patient enough to try to explain to violet the errors of her ways? Its not fair. To say that you don't find anything wrong with her posts is actually quite insulting. It insinuates that her behaviour is acceptable, and that members are taking offense for no reason/going on some hateful vendetta. Jonathan Jonathan, thank-you for this. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tarz Posted February 21, 2006 Share Posted February 21, 2006 Er, OK Tarz. I'm not quite sure what you're going on about but as you like. Whatever. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tarz Posted February 21, 2006 Share Posted February 21, 2006 Enough, violet will hopefully soon be gone. We can all move on and forget about her.Then you can say good riddance at long last hey Jonathan. Well I for one hope Violet goes nowhere and remains an active member of this forum. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kollision Posted February 21, 2006 Share Posted February 21, 2006 I agree Tarz, I liked her. BTW, she is gone. She told me she is off this forums sadly... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tarz Posted February 21, 2006 Share Posted February 21, 2006 I agree Tarz, I liked her. BTW, she is gone. She told me she is off this forums sadly... That's too bad........... I will not be forgetting her, despite what some people may desire. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jonathan Posted February 21, 2006 Share Posted February 21, 2006 seriously, how can you not see that she was rude and offensive? i mean, you may not have found her posts offensive, but that does not mean that they are not offensive to anyone. the fact is that the majority of people here did find her remarks unacceptable, and you lot just say "its a shame she's gone, i liked her". the fact that you dont acknowledge that people have been hurt and offended sucks. especially considering that these people are people you have known for ages/are close to/are good friends with. jonathan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Richard Posted February 21, 2006 Share Posted February 21, 2006 In my last post, I was agreeing that I don't understand why she gets different treatment than other people who basically say the same things in the same way. I generally do like her posts, not the ones where she has flipped out. Other people have flipped out too, I really don't think violet is to be held 100% responsible for these arguments, other people could have handled it differently, I think she got a particularly hostile response. I know people would say she was being hostile to start with, but how is being hostile back to something that you consider to be hostile going to help? As I've said from the start, I think her initial posts aren't hostile. She has become more paranoid and aggressive and childish in the recent posts, but many people have been ganging up on her, using a thin veil of 'polite language' to hide their very very obvious dislike of her. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
willpeavy Posted February 21, 2006 Share Posted February 21, 2006 For somebody who is offensive, mean, bad tempered, uses ineffective language, etc she sure gets a lot of attention Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tarz Posted February 21, 2006 Share Posted February 21, 2006 Yeah, I agree very much Rich. Violet was a soft/easy target basically, and given 'special treatment'. I found Jza much more offensive, yet he was given far greater leniency. Jza undoubtedly meant to offend and just looked for trouble basically. He wasn't barracked and told how to re-word his posts in the same way Violet was. I can't remember any posts asking for him to be banned. Violet isn't the first, nor be the last, to lash out on a forum when she shouldn't have done so, but I believe she got singled out and hung out to dry far more than others have been. Violet did get increasingly defensive and hostile in her later posts, which is partly understandable given the constant and continous questioning of her. I know I would probably react the same if repeatedly told what to do. Violet wasn't going to change her approach, so I am not surprised when she lashed out at those who attempted ( yes, with good intentions ) to 're-educate' her. Entirely predictable. So as Rich says, she is not the only one to blame here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jonathan Posted February 21, 2006 Share Posted February 21, 2006 i think that you will find that i did on several occasions point out to Jza when he was out of line, and i PMed rob about considering banning him. So anyways, i feel like i must apolagise for the vengeful, hateful, unfailingly spiteful vendetta that i, and many of the other members of the board waged against violet. it is clear that we are all small minded individuals who want to appear big, tough and important infront of our peers. it has nothing to do with the fact that violets behaviour was unacceptable from the start, she was given dozens of warnings/peices of advice/pleas to stop and she ignored them all. i will make a point of inviting the next genuinely unpleasant person i meet round for dinner. ill take some photos of me hugging them. will i then be forgiven then for my awful behaviour? jonathan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sinisterkungfu Posted February 21, 2006 Share Posted February 21, 2006 Yeah, I agree very much Rich. Violet was a soft/easy target basically, and given 'special treatment'. I found Jza much more offensive, yet he was given far greater leniency. Jza undoubtedly meant to offend and just looked for trouble basically. He wasn't barracked and told how to re-word his posts in the same way Violet was. I can't remember any posts asking for him to be banned. That's because JZA went out of his way to be offensive to the point where it was blatantly obvious that's what he was doing, and it was somewhat humorous at times. Violet on the other hand was totally serious, and even after constantly being told what she was doing, seemed unable to even comprehend the concept that she was offensive. Not exactly the sharpest knife in the drawer, that one. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jay Posted February 21, 2006 Share Posted February 21, 2006 That's too bad........... I will not be forgetting her, despite what some people may desire.I have never expressed a desire for violet to be banned or to even leave. I really don't like that people are saying good riddance to her. I wish her the best but I personally will not waste my time attempting to have a productive conversation with her in the future as she has this habit of jumping to misunderstandings and accusing me of supporting torture, etc. Now, again. I don't know what you mean when you say, you know exactly what I mean. OK? I really don't. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
compassionategirl Posted February 21, 2006 Share Posted February 21, 2006 (edited) Yeah, I agree very much Rich. Violet was a soft/easy target basically, and given 'special treatment'. I found Jza much more offensive, yet he was given far greater leniency. Jza undoubtedly meant to offend and just looked for trouble basically. He wasn't barracked and told how to re-word his posts in the same way Violet was. I can't remember any posts asking for him to be banned. Jza was treated with more leniency? You have got to be kidding me. Here are the facts, and I dont think they support that conclusion: 1) many more people came to Violet's defense during the time she was here than they did Jza's. I really dont want to name names, but the numbers speak for themselves. 2) Jza, in case you havent noticed, was not around as long as Violet was. 3) Many people, including myself, Jonathan and Big publicly called Jza on his ignorant, racist, crappy attitude, and also took him to task when he called you, tarz, an idiot (Chronicles of Narnia post). I will post the links in an edit to this post in a few minutes. EDIT: The two best examples have been deleted - they were in my Ireland post and Bigwbi's poem post, as well as the "Who do you look like post." So, no, Jza was not treated more leniently than Violet. And the reason is, I think, that most people here understood that Violet's heart was in the right place, unlike Jza's. Also, the reason why nobody had to keep repeating themselves to Jza is because he didnt constantly misunderstand people's posts :! But that hardly means that people were being more "lenient" with Jza. Edited February 21, 2006 by compassionategirl Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
compassionategirl Posted February 21, 2006 Share Posted February 21, 2006 Violet on the other hand was totally serious, and even after constantly being told what she was doing, seemed unable to even comprehend the concept that she was offensive. Not exactly the sharpest knife in the drawer, that one. I agree with Sinister (try not to faint skf). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
compassionategirl Posted February 21, 2006 Share Posted February 21, 2006 (edited) the fact that you dont acknowledge that people have been hurt and offended sucks. especially considering that these people are people you have known for ages/are close to/are good friends with. jonathan yes I find that very hurtful and mind-boggling as well J. That's too bad........... I will not be forgetting her, despite what some people may desire.I have never expressed a desire for violet to be banned or to even leave. I really don't like that people are saying good riddance to her. I wish her the best but I personally will not waste my time attempting to have a productive conversation with her in the future as she has this habit of jumping to misunderstandings and accusing me of supporting torture, etc. Yes, Jay, I have no doubt that you are being sincere. In fact, I specifically remember you posting to Violet that she was welcome on this forum. You have treated her the same as you have treated others, and you continue to be kind to her even though she has accused you of harbouring personal dislike for her in this very thread, which is one of the most inane and reckless statements that she has ever made on this forum. Edited February 22, 2006 by compassionategirl Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
compassionategirl Posted February 21, 2006 Share Posted February 21, 2006 (edited) see blue. In my last post, I was agreeing that I don't understand why she gets different treatment than other people who basically say the same things in the same way. I generally do like her posts, not the ones where she has flipped out. Other people have flipped out too, I really don't think violet is to be held 100% responsible for these arguments, other people could have handled it differently, I think she got a particularly hostile response. Nobody else but Violet has interacted in the following way: V: Please stop this bloddy barbaric torture of cats and dogs in Asia - those brutal savages are cold hearted murderers. Jay: I wonder if the treatment of cats and dogs in Asia has to do with cultural differences? V: I am against BLODDY BARBARIC TORTURE JAY. HOW CAN YOU THINK IT IS OKAY TO DEEP FRY MICE AND EAT THEM ALIVE? How some of you dont see a problem with this or are now turning around and stating that other people are like this too is not supported by facts. And it has NOT been with just Jay. It has been pretty much always been the case with Violet. I know people would say she was being hostile to start with, but how is being hostile back to something that you consider to be hostile going to help? As I've said from the start, I think her initial posts aren't hostile. I agree that her initial posts were not inappropriate as I have repeatedly stated. I agree that being hostile back is not the best way to react, and that is precisely what I numerously said on the thread which has unfortunately now been deleted. I wasnt being hostile to Violet from the start, and I was supportive of her. That is a fact that is easily provable. I think Jonathan and SKF can attest to that. But after seeing her constant abuse of other people on this forum...well, it works both ways. And the straw that broke the humans back for me was her inane response to Jay on this thread. She has become more paranoid and aggressive and childish in the recent posts, but many people have been ganging up on her, using a thin veil of 'polite language' to hide their very very obvious dislike of her. So what? People were not justified in defending their own posts and explaining to this woman that she misunderstood what they were trying to tell her? That she has misunderstood people constantly is also a fact that is provable. If she was being "ganged up" on, as you put it, it is because she was misunderstanding the posts of numerous people, and these numerous people had to keep clarifying their positions or the positions of others - it certainly wasnt gratuitous or unjustified. Edited February 21, 2006 by compassionategirl Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kollision Posted February 22, 2006 Share Posted February 22, 2006 She's gone, so why need to go on with the posting (not trying to sound smart, just asking)? Also, what happened to JZA? I am lost. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
veggymeggy Posted February 22, 2006 Share Posted February 22, 2006 JZA was banned. And I agree....Violet seems to have left voluntarily, time to put it to rest isn't it? Let's not let her keep us arguing amongst ourselve when she's not even here anymore. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Richard Posted February 22, 2006 Share Posted February 22, 2006 The reason why people defended violet and not Jza is because violet wasn't (initially) trying to upset people or attack them, she was actually trying to put across a point of view. Then people reacted to that in ways that other people didn't agree with, therefore there was a debate. With Jza, there can't have been a debate because he was just insulting people left right and centre for the sake of it, with no actual point of view being expressed, other than he doesn't like anyone I think people are 'justified' or whatever you want to call it, in responding to violet how they want to, it's just text on a screen after all, and I'm not attacking anyone, to me this whole thing isn't even heavy. But the way the conversation has gone, although unimportant to me, can't just be blamed on violet, I don't understand how people see her as the 'culprit' or whatever. If you think about how the threads would have gone if she was handled differently, I dunno, I don't believe they would have gone the way they did. She was put down and called names etc even before she had really said anything that aggressive in my opinion anyway. Yeah the later posts she made were very confusing, aggressive and childish and misguided definitely, and I don't value them. But like I said, that only started after she was grilled for ages. She has/had a short fuse, which isn't something I admire, but I wish people would deal with the purpose of words, rather than the words themselves, she wasn't trying to insult anyone to begin with, I really believe that, but people got carried away with her tone etc, it was all a bit unnecessary. What I meant about different treatment is that lots of people say meat eaters are murderers and bastards and hunters are scum and should be killed etc etc, it's not actually any different really, the main difference that seems to bug people is that she says that if people aren't as angry as her, then they're not real vegans / AR people. Now I don't agree with that, but I don't really care if she thinks that, I just think she is wrong. I don't need to attack her, I don't know where it comes from. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cristian Posted February 22, 2006 Share Posted February 22, 2006 jonathan wrote:the fact that you dont acknowledge that people have been hurt and offended sucks. especially considering that these people are people you have known for ages/are close to/are good friends with I think we have acknowledged that you and others have been offended by violet's posts. We've all read your posts and understand where you're coming from. However, I don't think that by expressing a different opinion we're undervaluing your feelings. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
willpeavy Posted February 22, 2006 Share Posted February 22, 2006 She's gone, so why need to go on with the posting (not trying to sound smart, just asking)? I was thinking the same. It's best to drop it because everyone has already written the same things a hundred times already. But the thread will probably go on in circles for pages... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kathryn Posted February 22, 2006 Share Posted February 22, 2006 So, no, Jza was not treated more leniently than Violet. And the reason is, I think, that most people here understood that Violet's heart was in the right place, unlike Jza's. Also, the reason why nobody had to keep repeating themselves to Jza is because he didnt constantly misunderstand people's posts :! But that hardly means that people were being more "lenient" with Jza. I agree completely.I don't think I ever responded to a post by Jza, because I just tried to ignore him. He obviously was an "agent provocateur." Violet, on the other hand, seems(ed?) to just express herself in an ineffective way, and misunderstand other people's posts, taking offense where none was intended or expressed. I personally admire her passion, but felt/feel that the way she expresses it at times would most definitely turn off non-vegans, let alone those who agree with her ideas. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kollision Posted February 22, 2006 Share Posted February 22, 2006 This is DEFINITELY going to be one of the longest threads EVER. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jay Posted February 23, 2006 Share Posted February 23, 2006 He obviously was an "agent provocateur."http://redwing.hutman.net/~mreed/Assets/enfantprovocateur.jpgEnfant Provocateur likes to stir up trouble because...because, well...just because. This species of Flame Warrior is almost always young and male - it could be just a hormone thing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kathryn Posted February 23, 2006 Share Posted February 23, 2006 Enfant Provocateur likes to stir up trouble because...because, well...just because. This species of Flame Warrior is almost always young and male - it could be just a hormone thing. Bien dit! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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