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My message to Robert


violet13
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What kind of people use language 'fuck' anyway?

 

The kind that have no patience for your refusal to listen to reason.

And just for fun:

Fuck:

n.

1.An act of sexual intercourse.

2.A partner in sexual intercourse.

3.A despised person.

4.Used as an intensive: What the fuck did you do that for?

 

To clarify, I was using #4.

 

(http://www.dictionary.com)

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I think it's a lost cause...

 

100% totally and completely agree. Having a dialogue with Violet is like doing this:

 

And as far as your boss comment, Violet, I wont even dignify that with a response except to say that funny, you had no problem with the way I "act" when I was defending you tooth and nail. Those days are over sista! You are a waste of my time and a waste of my energy, and, being the compassionate girl that I am, it takes quite a bit for me to turn my back on someone who obviously needs help. I sincerely hope that you get it, for the animals sake.

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I have only 3 words left to say in all of this, and they are "I give up!"

 

Violet does not wish to understand why people feel uncomfortable by her attitude but rather wants to turn it around to how our treatment of her is based on insults and can somehow, in her mind, be equated to the roots of how racism starts (an example she used). Someone like this cannot or does not want to learn, so she redirects all the facts at hand into a sympathy card to make herself the victim even when she is the attacker. Anyone who wants to continue to try and scream at a brick wall regarding the reasons why she offends people can most certainly do so, but I'm outta here!

 

Exactly. That is exactly it. She chooses not to understand or learn something from any of this. She has a one track mind with total tunnel vision, and I am sick of her constant misunderstanding of people.

 

Even the most seasoned activists still seek to learn from others and improve their activist methods, but not Violet. Violet is right and everybody else is wrong. period. Well, I think most of us have more important work to do than:

 

 

Hey, Ryan, wait for me!!!

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Sorry for missing this thread entirely. I have had a policy of mostly not reading and never responding to violets threads, because my self restraint is somewhat lacking when I deal with her.

 

I am resisting the urge to say I told you so! But that wouldnt be a mature thing to say so I wont.

 

Im curious to see the next forum that violet manages to turn on herself. I think over here on VBB&F she must have had her longest stay yet, and I admire the patience of you all, because her attitude is simply awful.

 

All I can say is good by and good riddance violet.

 

jonathan

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Jonathan, please know that I am still on other forum and I never get same treatment I get on this forum.

It is so interesting to know that I am admired on some forums where I keep posting my message for long time but when I post exactly same message in same style, some people on this forum react totally differently.

Only thing I can say is difference in people.

Richard defended me on Vegan Freak forum and he posted his message honestly but he was banned from two forums, so I don't feel upset at all if people on this forum don't accept me as what I am.

I feel much better when I stay away from this forum where some people get gather and treat me very unfairly.

I still don't understand why it is ok when other people do same thing I am doing and saying same thing I am saying but it is wrong if I say it and doing it.

Answer is people are posting their message based on likes and dislikes.

What is example?

I wasn't only I who used cap.

Compassionategirl used too but because some people like her, it is ok for her to use cap right?

Please do not deny it because I saw her use of cap with my own eyes on this forum.

When other people call animal abuser bastard or savage, it is perfectly ok but when I use this word, people are so quick to attack me.

Any honest person can see this discrimination toward people they don't like.

Good bye and good luck.

Thank you for giving me lesson of how racism was formed.

There is absolutely no reason for anybody( except few people who supported me) to respond to me because I am not going to read your message.

I am going to continue posting my message on old forum where I have many friends who support me and showing kindness to me.

Edited by violet13
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I agree violet I don't understand either, I like reading your posts

 

im pretty confused as to why you would want to defend her richard.

 

violet - yes, we are all horrible racists. we discriminate against any and all minorities, we dont like gays, liberals or indeed anyone. thankyou for helping me in this realisation.

 

please could you reference and link us to these sites where you are admired? i would need to see this with my own eyes...

 

jonathan

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I still don't understand why it is ok when other people do same thing I am doing and saying same thing I am saying but it is wrong if I say it and doing it.

 

You're taking specific examples and broadening them so that everyone who posts here applies. We are all individuals and have our own comfort levels for these things so please do not assume that everybody has the same opinion.

 

When other people call animal abuser bastard or savage, it is perfectly ok but when I use this word, people are so quick to attack me.

 

I have personally never attacked you but I wanted to point out that it may not have been the specific words you were saying that caused people to be upset but the manner in which you were speaking altogether about animal rights. The instances I've seen other people use these words were on occassion while you use them quite often and I think this is the reason people have gotten upset.

 

Thank you for giving me lesson of how racism was formed.

 

Racism is a prejudice against a certain race of people. It has nothing to do with reactions to a specific individual person. You are blowing this situation way out of proportion.

 

 

 

 

 

Violet, I don't have a problem personally with how you speak. You should hear how I speak about things when I'm among friends. However, I am concerned about the impression you may leave on nonvegans about veganism. If you have as many similar reactions as you've had here on this message board when talking with nonvegans then you will have a hard time changing their minds about the issues you care so strongly about.

 

The only reason I began to respond to you in this thread was because I wanted you to be able to effectively get your message across to people. Unfortunately I feel you don't care about being effective and though that is your choice it will only perpetuate the attitude people have towards veganism and animal rights and keep you unhappy. Perhaps you will prove me wrong.

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I'm glad other people are finally starting to understand my point of view about violet from the beginning. I just have much less tolerance for ignorance than the rest of you.

 

Since this was a general comment, I assume I am included in this and I dont want to be so let me clarify.

 

Your "point of view" is not the same as mine. My issue with Violet is not the same as yours Sinister. Your point of view about Violet, at least in part, was that you think her ar views (eg. boycott pet breeding, etc.) are stupid, ridiculous, insane, etc, and whatnot - but I hope you understand that, in an animal rights community, you are in the minority on that one. I think very few people here have any problems with the merits of her ar messages.

 

And Violet's comments like "animal abusers are barbaric savages" is also not out of line in my opinion. I agree with her that animal torturers are barbaric savages.

 

So to that extent, no, I dont agree with you at all. That has not changed, and I think that is clear. I have already explained my frustration in this thread, as have others, so I wont repeat it in this post. But after your post I felt i should clarify all this.

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I'm glad other people are finally starting to understand my point of view about violet from the beginning. I just have much less tolerance for ignorance than the rest of you.

 

Since this was a general comment, I assume I am included in this and I dont want to be so let me clarify.

 

Your "point of view" is not the same as mine. My issue with Violet is not the same as yours Sinister. Your point of view about Violet, at least in part, was that you think her ar views (eg. boycott pet breeding, etc.) are stupid, ridiculous, insane, etc, and whatnot - but I hope you understand that, in an animal rights community, you are in the minority on that one. I think very few people here have any problems with the merits of her ar messages.

 

So to that extent, no, I dont agree with you at all. That has not changed. I felt i should clarify that about your post.

 

No, I never said I disagreed with her views, it has always been her offensive extremist attitude that I've had a problem with. That and her willfil ignorance (ie. refusing to hear anyone else's opinions, and taking everything that's said to her, even when it's people defending her, as an insult). I think you're just afraid to agree with me.

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No, I never said I disagreed with her views, it has always been her offensive extremist attitude that I've had a problem with. That and her willfil ignorance (ie. refusing to hear anyone else's opinions, and taking everything that's said to her, even when it's people defending her, as an insult).I think you're just afraid to agree with me[/color].

 

 

 

But Sinister, you are implying in your message that there is a separation of her "views" on the one hand, and her "extremist attitiude", and that that you never said you disagreed with the former, only the latter. I guess then I am not sure what you mean by her extremist attitude. Do you mean like her call to boycott pet breeders for example?

 

If you will recall from the pet breeders thread, you described her message on that as extremist and stupid, and said you disagreed (page one of that thread). So I dont understand how you can say now that you never disagreed with her views, only her attitude.

 

As I said before, her call to boycott commercial pet breeding is consistent with animal rights. From an animal rights perspective ( which was the thread under which she appropriately posted her message), this is not extremist or stupid at all.

 

Of course, since animal rights fundamentally challenges the status quo, and necessitates a paradigm shift, it is viewed as 'extremist' by society, the same way that abolishing of black slavery was viewed as extremist at one time. I dont want to get into a theory of moral relativity discussion here - we already know where the other stands on that issue from an older thread.

 

So if you think her views (which reflect an animal rights position) are extremist, then you must think that other animal rights' peoples views are extremist as well. So that would be my views and all the other animal rights adherents' views on this board, and there are many ar adherents here.

 

I guess I just want it to be clear that none of violet's action alerts that I read (and I am pretty sure I read all of them) are inconsistent with my understanding of animal rights philosophy. If you have a problem with the school of thought itself, then that of course is an entirely different matter. But then your problem would be with animal rights and not Violet (putting aside the point in red for a moment).

 

The part in red is the part that I agree with - so see, I do agree with you on some stuff (try not to faint now!). I couldnt find a faint emoticon so you will have to settle for . Closest thing to fainting I could find.

Edited by compassionategirl
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No, I never said I disagreed with her views, it has always been her offensive extremist attitude that I've had a problem with. That and her willfil ignorance (ie. refusing to hear anyone else's opinions, and taking everything that's said to her, even when it's people defending her, as an insult).I think you're just afraid to agree with me[/color].

 

 

 

But Sinister, you are implying in your message that there is a separation of her "views" on the one hand, and her "extremist attitiude", and that that you never said you disagreed with the former, only the latter. I guess then I am not sure what you mean by her extremist attitude. Do you mean like her call to boycott pet breeders for example?

 

If you will recall from the pet breeders thread, you described her message on that as extremist and stupid, and said you disagreed (page one of that thread). So I dont understand how you can say now that you never disagreed with her views, only her attitude.

 

As I said before, her call to boycott commercial pet breeding is consistent with animal rights. From an animal rights perspective ( which was the thread under which she appropriately posted her message), this is not extremist or stupid at all.

 

Of course, since animal rights fundamentally challenges the status quo, and necessitates a paradigm shift, it is viewed as 'extremist' by society, the same way that abolishing of black slavery was viewed as extremist at one time. I dont want to get into a theory of moral relativity discussion here - we already know where the other stands on that issue from an older thread.

 

So if you think her views (which reflect an animal rights position) are extremist, then you must think that other animal rights' peoples views are extremist as well. So that would be my views and all the other animal rights adherents' views on this board, and there are many ar adherents here.

 

I guess I just want it to be clear that none of violet's action alerts that I read (and I am pretty sure I read all of them) are inconsistent with my understanding of animal rights philosophy. If you have a problem with the school of thought itself, then that of course is an entirely different matter. But then your problem would be with animal rights and not Violet (putting aside the point in red for a moment).

 

The part in red is the part that I agree with - so see, I do agree with you on some stuff.

 

The pet breeder thing is an exception, as I have no problems with responsible pet breeding. However I did also state in the same thread that I do have a problem with the so-called 'puppy mills', and with people like this - http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/11416403/site/newsweek/

By her views, I didn't mean the ar stuff specifically, but more along the lines of her thinking that everyone who doesn't feel the incoherent rage that she feels about pretty much everything is wrong, or is a barbarian, or isn't a good vegan or whatever. I get the feeling she's not a very happy person in general, so she comes on here to take out her aggression on anyone and everyone when what she really needs to do is pay a visit to a nice therapist.

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I skimmed the link you posted and I do feel enraged by it. My blood is boiling right now and I wish the individuals responsible for animal suffering could be subjected to the same suffering they inflict on others.

 

I dont think it is wrong to feel outraged and enraged - I think any kind and compassionate person would feel those emotions. How could one not feel fit to be tied when you read about they suffering of innocent animals? I think those who are unbothered by such suffering have a deficient moral character/capacity or whatnot. I really do. And I think those who directly engage in the abuse of animals are barbaric, despicable savages. I know that many people here have stated that they feel the same rage and outrage that Violet feels about the suffering of animals. It is not that we dont feel the same sense of moral outrage and . When I read, see or think about animal suffering it always takes my breath away, makes my blood pressure skyrocket, makes steam come out of my ears, and makes me so tense in my gut that I feel the need to vomit. My hands begin to tremble all around and I am overcome with adrenalin and rage. It is easy to feel all this when we try and put ourselves in the animals' shoes, and imagine the fear and pain they must feel. I dont think this is incoherent at all, and as a matter of fact, I think more empathy is what the world is lacking and desperately needs. I think many compassionate people feel the same way, even though they express it and channel it differently than say Violet.

Edited by compassionategirl
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I agree violet I don't understand either, I like reading your posts

 

I like your posts too Violet.

Tarz, I am against BLOODY BARBARIC TORTURE OF ANIMALS!!! Why do you think it's OK to deepfry mice and eat them alive?

 

That's it, I'm just going to ignore you and your attacks.

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Tarz,

 

I didn't insiunate that anyone had to not like Violet's posts in any way whatsoever. I simply don't like her accusatory tone toward people who are already animal activists - the message is quite fine by itself and I support it 100%, just not the delivery as I've stated over and over. I don't believe that this needs any more to be turned into another vegan-on-vegan interior squabble, so that's all I'm going to say about it, so no need to use my name directly to "call me out" despite many other people here who you know that also share a similar opinion (but weren't mentioned.)

 

There's already been enough time wasted on this - no need to drag it back up again and make everyone battle over the issue of how to get your message across without pissing off a large number of people who actually already agree with you. Jay was just using a bit of humor, which this thread could sorely use before anyone else gets cranky with each other. Case closed as far as I'm concerned.

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I like Violet's posts. I'm so not bothered in the slightest what Jay and VeganEssentials think about that.

Hey that was the idea of my last post. Just trying to post in a fashion that you would like. I really liked a lot of violet's post too. Seriously I did. And I'm very sorry things haven't worked out. I'm sure it's just because it's easier to misunderstand online.

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I like Violet's posts. I'm so not bothered in the slightest what Jay and VeganEssentials think about that.

Hey that was the idea of my last post. Just trying to post in a fashion that you would like. I really liked a lot of violet's post too. Seriously I did. And I'm very sorry things haven't worked out. I'm sure it's just because it's easier to misunderstand online.

 

I didn't misunderstand at all. I knew exactly what you were doing.

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Had missed this thread entirely...interesting. I hope we could put aside our differences now and in the future, we're all on the same side after all.

I didn't mind Violet's posts and actually went back to read a few before writing this message. They have "grit" which is good for activism, I agree with Jay, it's probably easier to be misunderstood online.

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Er, OK Tarz. I'm not quite sure what you're going on about but as you like.

 

ya i dont understand what he is goin on about either Jay.

 

99.9% of posters here have not had an issue, as far as I am aware, with her original posts - only the manner in which she subsequently interacted with vegans and activists that responded to her original posts - eg. attacking other animal activists and vegans and the way she misunderstands them constantly.

 

Ryan has summarized it best, and I have no idea why what he (and others) have said is so difficult to grasp.

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Hey, gotta post my two cents here.

 

I honestly cannot understand how anyone on this board, who has read violets posts, or interacted with her, can defend her attitude or many of her view points. I am being totally serious - it is incomprehensable.

 

It is unacceptable, whatever cause the person represents to be continuously rude, hateful and unapolagetic. This is especially true as the people who violet has acted like this towards are people one the same bloody side!

 

People here have been immensely patient with her, repeatedly explaining the blantantly obvious and giving her 2nd, 3rd, 4th, nth chances. Enough is enough.

 

So please can people not attact the members that have been patient enough to try to explain to violet the errors of her ways? Its not fair. I for instance really did not have the patience - I simply cannot do it, and I admire those who do/did.

 

To say that you don't find anything wrong with her posts is actually quite insulting. It insinuates that her behaviour is acceptable, and that members are taking offense for no reason/going on some hateful vendetta.

 

Enough, violet will hopefully soon be gone. We can all move on and forget about her.

 

Jonathan

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