Raising vegan babies and Vaccinations ?

[Flowerchild]

Hey, I'm a so soon to be mother with my first born and of course throughout my entire pregnancy I have been vegan. Which means my daughter has never had ANY animal products inside her tiny little body, not even medicines I have been prescribed by my OBG/YN. I have found ways to help my ion on my own and of course vegan prenatal vitamins.

 

Kylie is due in October, and I know generally babies get vaccines as soon as they're born. BUT the vaccines are definitely NOT vegan! and there are NO alternatives..... I don't want her pumped up with egg protein and gelatin as soon as she is born! I have read articles where a lot of vegan parents just dont get there children vaccinated, and then there are some who say the one time is necessary...

 

I dont want the vaccines, but I am terrified of what might happen if I dont get them, like her becoming sick... and I am also worried about enrolling her in school later down the line, because some school (at least when i was 5) wont allow children to participate if they're not vaccinated.

 

help!

[Fallen_Horse]

Vaccinations definitely do more good than harm. They really are essential to ensure that society stays healthy and free of epidemics. Getting your kids vaccinated is a potentially non-vegan thing that I think we have to do in modern society...

[beforewisdom]

You can Google on it, but a year or two ago the British pediatrician ( pediatrician in private practice.........not a medical researcher with the resources of formal studies ) who started the anti-vaccine movement was discredited.

 

It was discovered that he based everything he said on examining only 13 children.

 

He was also caught falsifying data

 

The National Institute Of Health and a few similar international health organizations spent years investigating the claims of anti-vaccination activists. Millions of dollars were spent on that research and no proof for any of the claims was found.

 

Additionally, many childhood diseases once banished are making a comeback because there are many parents skipping vaccinations. Not only do their own kids get sick, but other children who come into contact with their children get sick too.

[xChrisZx]

My son is 9 months, born at home, vegan, has never seen a doctor and perfectly healthy.

The only thing he has had was a vitamin k shot that our midwife recommended since he was three weeks early.

[Flowerchild]

thanks for the tips.

 

what are you planning on doing to do for school xChiszx?

[SAR]

because some school (at least when i was 5) wont allow children to participate if they're not vaccinated.

 

help!

Kinda weird that they dont let kids who are NOT vaccinated to participate. If all the other kids have been vaccinated then what are they afraid of? The vaccinated kids shouldnt get sick then right .. right?

 

I quit vaccinating myself many years ago.. flu shots.. everything. That is willingly putting poison into the body. No thanks. I am not a mother.... yet. I dont plan to be for a couple more years but I will not poison my future children thats for sure. You're right they are not vegan nor are they healthy.

 

Check these articles out.

 

http://www.naturalnews.com/036006_vaccination_doctor_form.html

http://www.naturalnews.com/034349_autism_vaccines_debunked.html

[beforewisdom]

There is a growing consortium of pediatricians who will not take a new patient if there parents don't vaccinate them.

[blabbate]

Absolutely get vaccinations. Or rather, I know this is a personal choice, but I urge you strongly to get the vaccinations, even if you alter the schedule slightly.

 

Vaccinations are vital for herd immunity, which is part of why schools are so strict about them. They also don't want deliberately unvaccinated children around other students who cannot receive vaccinations because they are immunosuppressed or otherwise incompatible. This includes newborns and the elderly.

 

There is no link between vaccines and autism, period. Vaccines do not contain dangerous levels of mercury. Anyone claiming otherwise has been misinformed.

 

From a pediatrician:

http://www.boston.com/bostonglobe/editorial_opinion/oped/articles/2010/03/21/lifesaving_safe_vaccines/

 

Rebuttal to some general anti-vax claims:

http://www.sciencebasedmedicine.org/index.php/vaccines-didnt-save-us-intellectual-dishonesty-at-its-most-naked/

 

Rebuttal of concerns about mercury/thimerosal:

http://antiantivax.flurf.net/#Thimerosal

http://skepdic.com/autismthimerosal.html

 

Rebuttal to accusations of "toxins" in vaccines:

http://www.sciencebasedmedicine.org/index.php/toxic-myths-about-vaccines/

http://www.harpocratesspeaks.com/2012/04/demystifying-vaccine-ingredients.html

 

Studies show no link between vaccines and autism:

http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/badastronomy/2008/05/12/vaccines-do-not-cause-autism/

 

Why the NVIC is so very wrong:

http://www.skepdic.com/fisherbl.html

 

Testimonial from an immunosuppressed MD:

http://www.nytimes.com/2011/12/28/opinion/for-the-herds-sake-vaccinate.html?_r=2

[beforewisdom]

Vaccinations are vital for herd immunity, which is part of why schools are so strict about them. They also don't want deliberately unvaccinated children around other students who cannot receive vaccinations because they are immunosuppressed or otherwise incompatible. This includes newborns and the elderly.

 

Exactly, the choice to not get one's child vaccinated isn't just the personal choice of the parent. It is a choice they are imposing on their child which may kill their child, kill other children and make other people sick.

 

 

There is no link between vaccines and autism, period. Vaccines do not contain dangerous levels of mercury. Anyone claiming otherwise has been misinformed.

From a pediatrician:

http://www.boston.com/bostonglobe/editorial_opinion/oped/articles/2010/03/21/lifesaving_safe_vaccines/

 

Rebuttal to some general anti-vax claims:

http://www.sciencebasedmedicine.org/index.php/vaccines-didnt-save-us-intellectual-dishonesty-at-its-most-naked/

 

Rebuttal of concerns about mercury/thimerosal:

http://antiantivax.flurf.net/#Thimerosal

http://skepdic.com/autismthimerosal.html

 

Rebuttal to accusations of "toxins" in vaccines:

http://www.sciencebasedmedicine.org/index.php/toxic-myths-about-vaccines/

http://www.harpocratesspeaks.com/2012/04/demystifying-vaccine-ingredients.html

 

Studies show no link between vaccines and autism:

http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/badastronomy/2008/05/12/vaccines-do-not-cause-autism/

 

Why the NVIC is so very wrong:

http://www.skepdic.com/fisherbl.html

 

Testimonial from an immunosuppressed MD:

http://www.nytimes.com/2011/12/28/opinion/for-the-herds-sake-vaccinate.html?_r=2

 

So awesome that you are providing references for your opinion and simply not repeating web board folklore.

 

I'm going to save these references and read them.

 

+1

[FormicaLinoleum]

Absolutely get vaccinations. Or rather, I know this is a personal choice, but I urge you strongly to get the vaccinations, even if you alter the schedule slightly.

Seconded.

 

Thanks for the links. My favourite thing was in the first article about toxins, where he quotes some guy who tried to make sucrose (table sugar) in vaccines sound dangerous!

[C.O.]

I just saw this related article from Time:

 

http://healthland.time.com/2012/08/23/antibiotic-use-in-early-infancy-linked-to-later-weight-gain/

 

-Dylan

[divamom]

About Schools,...as I did both and I live in a high traffic border city- and I placated my children's non Veg dad ( I was vegetarian, not vegan when my kids were born decades ago, or so it seems, and I HAVE BEEN kicked out of a pediatric practice for not doing what the doc's suggested- My crowning glory ( it really was):

After grade school, I put my foot down on ALL vaccines (my middle developed whooping cough in 6th grade anyways)- ALL SCHOOLS, ALL DISTRICTS, ALL STATES-

You can sign a waiver and submit to the schools and say, "NO, I am not doing any vaccinations",.in doing so, you say you are responsible and will not sue any one if an epidemic breaks out, that you are aware of the inherent health considerations, and if an epidemic should break out- you will not send your child to the school, nor hold anyone responsible for any disease contracted, should one be contracted.

 

However, please keep in mind- Polio has been practically eradicated due to vaccines. I encourage you to keep an open mind to the benefits modern medicine does carry and strike up a healthy balance between traditional and non traditional medicines ( you will hear to it referred to an Allopathic vs. homeopathic)- as we did both for years, and my kids have been traditonally med free except for things like severe asthma, whooping cough, strep and staph infections, and we had Respiratory Syndrome Virus sweep through when my daughter was 9 months ( she is 16 now)-

[beforewisdom]

These just came out yesterday

 

Intentionally Unvaccinated Students Putting Other Children at Risk

 

Study says unvaccinated students putting other students at risk

[blabbate]

You can sign a waiver and submit to the schools and say, "NO, I am not doing any vaccinations",.in doing so, you say you are responsible and will not sue any one if an epidemic breaks out, that you are aware of the inherent health considerations, and if an epidemic should break out- you will not send your child to the school, nor hold anyone responsible for any disease contracted, should one be contracted.

This is a massive misunderstanding of herd immunity and the actual dangers of refusing vaccination. Your child is not the only one at risk, and your agreement not to sue or send your child to school if an epidemic breaks out doesn't help prevent the epidemic from happening in the first place, nor does it protect the other students.

 

However, please keep in mind- Polio has been practically eradicated due to vaccines. I encourage you to keep an open mind to the benefits modern medicine does carry and strike up a healthy balance between traditional and non traditional medicines ( you will hear to it referred to an Allopathic vs. homeopathic)- as we did both for years, and my kids have been traditonally med free except for things like severe asthma, whooping cough, strep and staph infections, and we had Respiratory Syndrome Virus sweep through when my daughter was 9 months ( she is 16 now)-

Homeopathy does nothing, and anecdotal evidence doesn't change that.

 

General info:

http://www.1023.org.uk/

http://www.skepdic.com/homeo.html

 

Studies show that homeopathy is no more effective than placebos:

http://www.hutch.demon.co.uk/prescrire/

http://www.quackwatch.org/01QuackeryRelatedTopics/homeo.html

 

Comprehensive study of homeopathic test studies from 1945 to 1995 (spoiler alert: they're horribly flawed):

http://www.clubdelarazon.org/downloads/homeopatia45-95.pdf

 

Studies and condemnations from the House of Commons STC and the CBC:

http://www.sciencebasedmedicine.org/index.php/homeopathy-gets-a-reality-check-in-the-uk/

http://www.skepticnorth.com/2011/01/cbc-marketplace-investigates-homeopathy-a-review/

 

Also, homeopathy in place of traditional medicine can be fatal:

http://whatstheharm.net/homeopathy.html

 

And finally, just for fun:

http://darryl-cunningham.blogspot.com/2010/06/homeopathy.html

[beforewisdom]

^^^^ +1 ^^^^

[beforewisdom]

About Schools,...as I did both and I live in a high traffic border city- and I placated my children's non Veg dad

 

What does being vegetarian or not have to do with believing that vaccines are not harmful? There are plenty of carnists among the vaccine denialists. There are many vegans who use vaccines for their children and who fully accept medical science.

[divamom]

the topic was raising vegan babies and vaccines-

I was stating my ex was a non vegan or vegetarian in addition to being a meat eating piece of poop asshole. Thats all.

[divamom]

Bruce..

 

I am not of a herd

 

how rude

 

If I were an uneducated twit, it'd be different...i am not.

 

And you did your kids, right? Now, THAT's a herd! Everyone running to the pediatrician to get vaccines because someone said to.

 

I forget why I don't like to come her to post, till I read crap like this.

Edited August 28, 2012 by divamom

[blabbate]

the topic was raising vegan babies and vaccines-

I was stating my ex was a non vegan or vegetarian in addition to being a meat eating piece of poop asshole. Thats all.

 

On that note, vaccines are certainly non-vegan, and probably non-vegetarian by any reasonable definition, but in my opinion, sometimes you just need to go with the greater good. It's a responsibility as a member of general society. Please please please at least give consideration to a full schedule of vaccines.

[blabbate]

Bruce..

 

I am not of a herd

 

how rude

This is a joke, right? It must be. We're all part of a herd when it comes to disease.

 

And you did your kids, right? Now, THAT's a herd! Everypne running to teh pediatrician to get vaccines. Oy. Ignorance is not bliss, I tell ya.

Of course! My son is fully vaccinated. I wouldn't have it any other way.

[divamom]

and I wouldnt have it your way. My son STILL got a full case of whooping cough...and he was vaccinated.

 

just be careful when insulting someone's intelligence...cause you only insult your own.

[divamom]

logging off, done- have a day

[blabbate]

and I wouldnt have it your way. My son STILL got a full case of whooping cough...and he was vaccinated.

Not every vaccine is 100% effective. Again, that's where herd immunity is important. It also helps protect people for whom the vaccine was not sufficient. It's about preventing a few isolated cases of pertussis from becoming outbreaks. And again, anecdotal evidence tells us nothing.

 

just be careful when insulting someone's intelligence...cause you only insult your own.

I'm really not worried about that. This isn't about your intelligence. Frankly, it's about your knowledge. If I thought you were unintelligent I wouldn't be trying to convince you of anything. Instead, I'm urging you to do the research. Ignore anecdotes and look at actual evidence. Go read the studies. Familiarize yourself with the science. These are the same research methods and standards of proof that are behind things like asthma medications and antibiotics. If we made decisions based on isolated cases and anecdotes, we would still be stuck at trepanning and bloodletting.

[divamom]

Taught in a hospital Childbirth Education for over 8 years, and three years at my local Community College in Continuing Ed. I don't do anything half assed or half cocked when it comes to my children/ family and their health. I have read. And I do know. A pharmacist's daughter, and I used to read the PDR for fun in college. I am quite informed of my decisions- and read nursing manuals and pediatric journals. Oh and used to do a quarterly seminar with a prominent La Jolla physician when I was still working at the hospital. Again...you are coming from a bias...I am coming from neutral. Go back and reread my original reply...I have melded allopathic and homeopathic for years---I mentioned polio was eradicated due to vaccines...I am neutral. I chose NOT to do anymore vaccines in middle school, they kept changing and adding more. Upon further research, I made my decisions to stop. I don't have a newborn. My youngest is 16...the other are in their twenties, and two of the vaccines they were SUPPoSED to have, ...well, those have already been removed and replaced with something else. Its constantly evolving and sometimes...NOT for the greater good. Oh,...and I kept my kids home from school during chicken pox as I DID not do varicella, and I kept my son out when he had whooping cough. Your broad assumptions are just that...broad.

On the flip side, I am sure you are a nice guy...just extremely opinionated and not necessarily in the right...just opinionated.

 

The original question posed was the issue of schools; I shared..you can sign a waiver if you choose not to immunize. Thats knowledge based. The choice to immunize or not is personal..all I did was answer a question..with fact and personal experience. Kudos that you did for your son..how old is he? I guaranfuckingtee that the immunization schedule is radically different than the ones my kids got...life is too short to quibble over this...now if you really want an argument and studies thrown back at you on WHY NOT TO...go read Jenny McCarthy's book,

[FormicaLinoleum]

Do people who are anti-vaccine think that widespread vaccination is actually unrelated to the decline (near elimination of) dangerous diseases? Or do they acknowledge that vaccination programs have basically eliminated those diseases, but just think that there are negative side effects that mean that we're all better off not vaccinating--i.e., those diseases would probably come back if vaccination ended, but the deaths that would results aren't as bad as the negative side effects they believe exist? Do they think no one should be vaccinated? Or do they just not want their own kids to be vaccinated (relying on the majority of other parents to continue vaccinating their children at a high enough rate to prevent the return of the diseases)?

 

I just don't quite understand the end goal. I mean, I can kind of understand being concerned about side effects (most medical treatments have some (it's clear autism is not one of them, though)), but I don't understand thinking those are bad enough that they are worse than the return of epidemic levels of childhood diseases that can kill or cause long term disability.