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Is Robert really Vegan? Maybe Not.


karlhubris
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Wow, I bet that got your attention...I think the debate on who can call themselves vegan is really kinda lame. I got turned on to Clif bars by reading this site a few years ago based on one of Robert's articles. I've found alot of inspiration here to improve my diet and workout habits...but today as I was buying groceries I decided to read the Clif bar ingredients just out of curiousity...I was stunned...it states in bold face letters "MAY CONTAIN TRACES OF DAIRY"...uh-oh...call the vegan police and shut down the site! I probably knew that before, I'm pretty good about reading labels. But I was kinda perturbed about some one calling my actions "anti-vegan". Should I have eaten those Reeses peanut butter cups...No...did I have a little guilt...well a little. Do a few moments of weakness negate 15 years of trying to make a difference...apparently to some it does. My point is this...just by coming to this site it's obvious someone is at least trying to make a difference. Just trying isn't always good enough, but sometimes its a start. It's great to encourage one another, like AA or something...can I call someone and say..."man, I really think I need some Boca smoked sausage right now,but it's not vegan...can you talk me down?" Honestly, some people have made me question myself and if I am really trying as hard as I should, others have made me ask, what the hell are they trying to prove?

By the way... I think Roberts vegan, but I think what matters most is how Robert defines himself.

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I think Robert is as vegan as it gets and is one of the biggest promoters of the vegan lifestyle throughout the world

 

But that is just my take on it

 

I do have issues with Clif bar, Genisoy and other companies that may contain traces of dairy, etc. One good choice it to Go VEGA! www.myvega.com

 

No worries, Robert is Mr. Vegan

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Nice call...but if you have problems they are a new issue...I started eating them on your recomendation! Maybe since you started working for Vega?

 

for info see article "What Does Robert Eat?" Feb. 28th, 2004

 

Thanx for the site, it's very helpful...even if you tricked me into eating anti-vegan Clif bars.

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"May contain traces of" means that the product you are buying was processed on machinery that also processes dairy. This does not mean that some worker was carrying around a bucket of milk, tripped, and got it in the batch of cliff bars. Its simply an insurance policy incase someone who is HIGHLY allergic to dairy (or peanuts, or soy...) eats the product and has an allergic reaction. The product is still vegan.

 

It would be like cooking your vegan food on your non-vegan friend's cleaned pots and pans.

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That really just means cliff doesn't have the budget(yet) to have their own equipment and sure they're big but not big enough yet. Until the grow more they can't have their own plants. Without contracting these larger businesses there would barely be any vegan prepared foods...it takes quite a while for a food company to be completely independant.

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I am fully aware of that...you are missing the context...to some vegan police that is a no-no! Obviously even Robert said he had a bit of a problem with that. The point was this, one more time...we all weigh our risks/reward...I think for most of us that is an acceptable risk. I could get on my high horse and say " that means your supporting someone who supports the dairy industry!...heretic!!" I think its a pretty simple concept.

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Alot of those manufacturing houses are actually not associated with a company at all...someone mass orders the goods by finding the lowest bidder and the plant makes the stuff...the plant may not have anything to do with what comes in...they just get a recipe and make it. If a company didn't want to be a part of that sure they could be but then they'd have to charge $5 a bar and the dairy industry wouldn't be hurt or gain a thing in the meantime...cliff getting big through this process had made it a popular bar amongst non-vegans keeping them from buy the slightly cheaper non vegan bars.

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Heretic! Can you put a price on exploitation?! If you can't do it 100% vegan you can't do it at all! Who cares about the long term rewards and strategic thinking to help create a world more open to vegan products! HERESY!!!

I think that would sound better in a Shakesperean dialect and vocalization...

(enter pious vegan)...Heresy! Canst thou put a price on exploitation? If thou canst act in total accordance with thy law of veganism, thou canst not act at all! Oh pity the advances of a world that has forsaken utter veganism for the sake of the accession of veganism! HERESY!

(end scene...exit stage right)

 

I'm not exactly a playwright, but that'll do...

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I am fully aware of that...you are missing the context...to some vegan police that is a no-no! Obviously even Robert said he had a bit of a problem with that. The point was this, one more time...we all weigh our risks/reward...I think for most of us that is an acceptable risk. I could get on my high horse and say " that means your supporting someone who supports the dairy industry!...heretic!!" I think its a pretty simple concept.

Buying a vegan product that is made in the same factory in which dairy-containing products are made is not supporting the dairy industry. None of the money for the vegan product is going towards the dairy because the dairy is unrelated to the vegan product and often to the company that makes the vegan product.

 

Like someone else said, it's like cooking vegan food in a kitchen that is not vegan. It would be like when I go to my parents--I eat vegan there, but they have meat and eggs and dairy there and there may be traces of non-vegan on the stuff in their kitchen. I would not consider my food non-vegan just because I prepared it in their kitchen. I certainly would not think that by eating my vegan stuff that I made in their kitchen, I was supporting the dairy industry.

 

Yeah, some super-strict vegans would not eat anything that "may contain traces of dairy" but that would have more to do with personal purity than with supporting the dairy industry.

 

But if you go out and buy a product that actually contains dairy as one of its ingredients, then that is supporting the dairy industry.

 

I don't think that eating something non-vegan automatically causes one to no longer be a vegan. I'd call most vegans who make a slip now and then vegans who make a slip. I'm sure tons of us make slips now and then, of varying degrees. But intent matters. If a person intends to be vegan, but slips up, I'd still consider the person vegan. But if the person intends to eat nearly vegan, but always has the intention to allow him/herself to eat X non-vegan thing, then I would not call that person vegan.

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Heretic! Can you put a price on exploitation?! If you can't do it 100% vegan you can't do it at all! Who cares about the long term rewards and strategic thinking to help create a world more open to vegan products! HERESY!!!

Is anyone here actually saying that? That if you can't be 100% vegan then you should just eat all the meat, dairy, and eggs you want?

 

I think I may have missed the critical part of the discussion. But if it's just that someone has said that people who eat, for example, dairy products now and then are not vegans, I don't see this as elitist or judgemental. It doesn't mean that they don't think that cutting down on meat, dairy, and eggs isn't worthwhile.

 

I dunno, I guess I would have to see the offending post(s)--I haven't seen anything harsh.

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That is exactly my point! We all have our own standards! As long as those standards fit a certain parameter "alles klar!" Jeez! I don't need some jackass telling me I'm not vegan because I've eaten 4 peanut butter cups in the last 10 friggin' years!

And for clarities sake...it was in reference to a Clif bar which stated "May Contain dairy"...to some people that's big friggin' deal...it's not to me...it may be at a later time...but I certainly am not going to jump on a high horse and start dictating standards to people...and I can think of some pretty high standards...like injesting more than 1500 calories a day or eating jalapenoes is not vegan-they are luxuries that lead to the unnecessary killing of animals in the harvest process- just so you can bulk up or enjoy spicy foods! You selfish, selfish bastards. How can you sleep at night?

See it's pretty easy, and trust me I've considered those standards, but for myself, no one else...so the vegan police should worry about their own standards and let others decide for themselves...

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I was told that was pretty harsh...yikes! I should admit fault for getting bent out of shape...I did think that Shakespeare and Jackie Chan quote were funny tho...

I should drop the issue...There's too many cool people here to risk pissing people off...I'm secure in my veganism, and I'm doing just what I don't want others to do, and thats be divisive...lets talk about things that unify us, like...politics & religion

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So i looked at the bag my oranges came in and it said they are "coated with food-grade vegetable, beeswax and/or lac-resin based wax or resin" anyone else have this on their oranges? How can I get oranges without it? And is this type of wax on other fruits?

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I've never seen any fruit say that...I'm thinking with the new law passed if it has lacto resin it would have to say...beeswax too maybe

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It would be an issue if it were harvested bee pollen but its not...its natural just like if we were living in the wild our food would be fertilized with deer crap...if we caged deer, forcefed them for their poo then that would be different...same with the bees

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someone posted once (here or some other board) that fruit need bee pollon to grow properly or something like that..... i guess we cant eat fruit anymore lol

 

Vegetables neither. A lot of ( nearly all I think ) veggies are cultivated using animal manure as a fertiliser.

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Just to be clear...someone thought I was criticizing Robert...I was joking plus I figured that would be an attention getter. To make it clear...

1) I love Clif bars

2) I love this site

3) I love the positive feed back

4) I love being vegan

5) I lo...uh...respect Robert (don't really know him that well, but seems like a nice guy)

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For the most part manure is a free bye product...cattle farmers don't want it and in most cases they just allow companies to take the manure.

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someone posted once (here or some other board) that fruit need bee pollon to grow properly or something like that..... i guess we cant eat fruit anymore lol

 

Vegetables neither. A lot of ( nearly all I think ) veggies are cultivated using animal manure as a fertiliser.

 

shit... o well i guess i have to start to like eating rocks.... yuuuuuuum rocks

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Some have asked about my issues with Clif, Genisoy, etc.

 

I still use their products, I just wish they didn't have to share a facility that uses dairy products. I still think it's better to support companies and products that don't use dairy in their facility at all, but supporting Clif bars, keeps all the whey bars and powerbars at bay.

 

Remember if you do have any issues with Clif, there are many vegan alternatives like Vega, Lara, Organic Food Bar, Think Organic, etc. and all of those I just mentioned are healthier too. That being said, I've already consumd 2 Clif Builder bars today, but I eat more raw bars like Vega than I do Clif.

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So i looked at the bag my oranges came in and it said they are "coated with food-grade vegetable, beeswax and/or lac-resin based wax or resin" anyone else have this on their oranges? How can I get oranges without it? And is this type of wax on other fruits?

 

Were they organic oranges? We try to be 100% organic - and I don't recall seeing the beeswax warning on organic produce. We wouldn't buy it if it did (our personal preference).

 

Am I the only one that thinks Clif bars suck? They don't taste that good anyway, then sit in my belly like sand. I respect what the company does, but there are much tastier and belly-friendly vegan bars out there, IMHO.

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