For those interested in history/politics...

[Guest]

I hate to admit it but a minute percentage of those billions were spent on me...he loved watching me eat. As for Imelda...I haven't seen her since 94(maybe a bit after) I think but she definately isn't running short on funds...she still buys a bunch of shoes and has no shortage of people to do everything for her in her lovely house.

[_raVen_]

...The Carter Administration engineered an $88 million World Bank loan to Marcos, increased military aid to him by 300%, and called him a "soft dictator"....

 

Another example of Saint Carter's good will

 

 

I am conflicted...I guess its similar to Sunnis loving Saddam Hussein

 

Or like the Germans and Hitler. Sadly -- and to me, personally, angering -- is when people blame the People, whose government's gone off the deep end. I hear/read/see it all the time against Americans...It's fashionable to be anti-American, though, so, there it is -- no actual intellectualizing goes into blind hate. Most people like to feel superior -- especially when it's vs. the U.S. -- because in actuality, they have inferiority complexes (mass, national inferiority; not real inferiority, but a complex. Of course no one People is better than another.) "The bigger they are, the harder they fall," afterall; and no one wants to see any "one" fall more than they want to see the U.S. fall.

 

My sympathies have always been with the People; never with their respective governments. I can support the Iranian People, but not what the government is doing; I can support Iraqis, and despise Saddam; I can abhor the Israeli government and love the Israeli People; I can hate the Third Reich, but have sympathy for and extend understanding to the German People.

It's sad that people who think themselves so "liberal," so "just" spew hate at Americans while believing they are on the side of "justice" because they hate "America" and extend it to the People. To me, those people are on the same level as the governments they hate, and no matter how right they think they are, their hatred renders it moot and deserving of NO respect -- hypocrites.

And my question to them is always, "So what is your country doing?" Or, more often than not, "What is your country not doing, and why?" the answer to which, in most cases, makes them, at *best* just as guilty/wrong.

 

Yea, just a li'l pet peeve of mine

 

So, needless to say, Potter, you should not feel conflicted. I do understand why you do, though; and it's much easier said than done. You were a child, afterall; and you were unaware.

[_raVen_]

 

*I've been meaning to tell/ask you if you know of the Bill Moyers series, "Faith & Reason,"...

 

so I thought of you particularly with the conversation Moyers had with scientist, Sir John Houghton -- excellent, and my favorite so far; but also the interview with Amis, where he proclaims he's changed from calling himself an atheist, and now considers himself agnostic...

 

Hey, Jay, I know you're busy, but you can see/hear/read the interviews online: Here is the Houghton interview You can click on "the forgotten classic flatland" for a quickie, if you don't have time right now, to give you a little preview.

 

By the way, what do you think should be China's next move? They're in a tough spot...Dealing with Kim Jong-il seems to have landed in their lap again. Military response, I'm assuming is out of the question...

You know, it doesn't seem to matter -- the proposal to impose sanctions is only going to piss off J-il and, really, I don't think he gives a damn. He is already starving the People (in more ways than one); so I see him not allowing the aid -- food, services -- in to the country just to show his defiance. He just seems that kinda guy to me.

[Jay]

 

*I've been meaning to tell/ask you if you know of the Bill Moyers series, "Faith & Reason,"...

 

so I thought of you particularly with the conversation Moyers had with scientist, Sir John Houghton -- excellent, and my favorite so far; but also the interview with Amis, where he proclaims he's changed from calling himself an atheist, and now considers himself agnostic...

 

Hey, Jay, I know you're busy, but you can see/hear/read the interviews online: Here is the Houghton interview You can click on "the forgotten classic flatland" for a quickie, if you don't have time right now, to give you a little preview.

 

By the way, what do you think should be China's next move? They're in a tough spot...Dealing with Kim Jong-il seems to have landed in their lap again. Military response, I'm assuming is out of the question...

You know, it doesn't seem to matter -- the proposal to impose sanctions is only going to piss off J-il and, really, I don't think he gives a damn. He is already starving the People (in more ways than one); so I see him not allowing the aid -- food, services -- in to the country just to show his defiance. He just seems that kinda guy to me.

OK. I'll try to watch that this evening. I saw the thing last night on PBS with Houghton. Sorry I haven't been posting here lately. I missed one of your posts above also. I'll answer it when I have a chance.

 

The only problem with religion is they seem to usually get around to making it illegal to be an atheist/agnostic/etc once they get a big enough majority. Other than that it doesn't have to be such a bad thing I guess. I like the liberation theologists in Latin America (although they've been massacred by US supported regimes). The truly religious wouldn't support Bush for a number of reasons if they just knew what's really going on. Most recently there's a book coming out about how BushCo secretly makes fun of evangelicals, calling them nuts, etc.

 

I'll answer more later. I'm working 12 days straight then I get a weekend off and I'm trying to fix up my house, put siding on, new doors, etc.

[_raVen_]

OK. I'll try to watch that this evening. I saw the thing last night on PBS with Houghton. Sorry I haven't been posting here lately. I missed one of your posts above also. I'll answer it when I have a chance.

 

The only problem with religion is they seem to usually get around to making it illegal to be an atheist/agnostic/etc once they get a big enough majority. Other than that it doesn't have to be such a bad thing I guess. I like the liberation theologists in Latin America (although they've been massacred by US supported regimes). The truly religious wouldn't support Bush for a number of reasons if they just knew what's really going on. Most recently there's a book coming out about how BushCo secretly makes fun of evangelicals, calling them nuts, etc.

 

I'll answer more later. I'm working 12 days straight then I get a weekend off and I'm trying to fix up my house, put siding on, new doors, etc.

 

Oh, yea, I was surprised Houghton was on the "Is God Green" special; I wasn't expecting to see him there . But, yes, watch/listen to his interview when you can; I'm sure the link will be up for a long time. The other interviews are good too, by the way.

 

About w making fun of evangelicals, it doesn't surprise me. I had not heard that he did that, but I do know that many of the others who are in office because of kowtowing to the RR, do so. Sick. Doesn't it bother you how all this shit comes out now? It does me. It's like suddenly no one wants to admit having voted for/supported the duffer...irritating. Where were all these brave "journalists" and authors when it counted? That's why I have little respect for their "revelations" now; it's not like We didn't know this stuff a long time ago -- and in fact, were protesting, writing, and blogging about it. (I do admire some publications, of course, like Mother Jones, The Nation; and bloggers like David Corn, Arianna Huffington, etc., who had journalistic integrity in this era of journalistic failings to tragic, tragic consequences...)

I hate when People act like they were blindsided by w or this admin...I don't buy it. There's no excuse -- at least for many of them.

I still do believe, though, that the majority did not want w and the "polling" and the voting results were skewed. Too many shenanigans to believe otherwise -- way too many.

 

You're working so much I'm actually working less lately...

Make sure to get enough sleep I didn't know you bought a house! I thought you were in an apartment. Well, good luck with it . If you can do it yourself, that's great; working with contractors is such a p.i.a.

[Jay]

Oh, yea, I was surprised Houghton was on the "Is God Green" special; I wasn't expecting to see him there . But, yes, watch/listen to his interview when you can; I'm sure the link will be up for a long time. The other interviews are good too, by the way.

Ok, I will. So you didn't know that show would be so much about West Virginia then?

 

You're working so much I'm actually working less lately...

Make sure to get enough sleep

Work and college.

 

You know, those blueberry smoothies make a huge difference for me with sleep. Often I have to get up at either 4:30am or 5:30 for work and without those smoothies I just don't get enough sleep. I hate to be so dependent on them but I'm glad I figured out how they help as I spent a lot of time being sleep deprived in the past.

 

I didn't know you bought a house! I thought you were in an apartment. Well, good luck with it . If you can do it yourself, that's great; working with contractors is such a p.i.a.

It's a 100 year old house that my dad bought for $750 dollars of unpaid taxes. He gave it to us. It's not much to look at but i don't mind. It's a decent neighborhood. Luckily my father-in-law has experience with this stuff and is showing my how to do stuff (install windows, doors, siding.) It slants sort of like in the Willy Wonka movie.... but the foundation is OK.

[Jay]

Check this out, Jay. I saw this a week or so ago, and, unfortunately, in its entirety is now in the archives; but, you get the gist of it. Rather ghoulish, I believe.

 

A quote from the above: ""...The Mayor's idea is part of a growing trend in Russia for extreme tourism.

...In that same spirit the governor of Vladimir Lenin's native region recently floated plans to open a Leninland theme park that would also allow visitors to experience elements of the Gulag. Mr Shpektor contends that his "Club Gulag" holiday camp would remind people of the horrors of Stalin's repression in a way that dry history books cannot."

From what I've heard... the death rate in the gulags was about the same as in US jails, except during WWII. Also the percentage of people in gulags wasn't much different from in US jails. But I'm not super certain of this stuff. I'd need to read more. Alexander Solzhetsin (sp) (I just cannot spell that guys name) was pretty dishonest and his anti-Stalin propaganda (A day in the life of ... some guy in the gulags) and (The Gulag Archipelago) were released because Krushchev was trying to discredit Stalin. Solzhetsin was actually a spy and a fascist (I'm told at least by someone who's proven pretty trustworthy) and not very honest.

 

But again, I haven't researched the Gulags well enough. I'd like to get some books by Arch J. Getty and other scholars but I'd have to buy them as they aren't in local libraries... Don't have time either right now anyway.

 

Saw this on LewRockwell the other day.

 

Five years ago, I wrote a column about the unknown Holocaust in Ukraine. I was shocked to receive a flood of mail from young Americans and Canadians of Ukrainian descent telling me that until they read my article, they knew nothing of the 1932–33 genocide in which Stalin's regime murdered 7 million Ukrainians and sent 2 million to concentration camps.

 

How, I wondered, could such historical amnesia afflict so many young North-American Ukrainians? For Jews and Armenians, the genocides their people suffered are vivid, living memories that influence their daily lives. Yet today, on the 70th anniversary of the destruction of a quarter of Ukraine's population, this titanic crime has almost vanished into history's black hole.

There's an online book called Fraud, Famine and Fascism that talks about this lie. The 2 million being sent to concentration camps is a part I hadn't heard before though.

 

So has the extermination of the Don Cossacks by the Soviets in the 1920's, and Volga Germans, in 1941; and mass executions and deportations to concentration camps of Lithuanians, Latvians, Estonians, and Poles. At the end of World War II, Stalin's gulag held 5.5 million prisoners, 23% Ukrainians and 6% Baltic peoples.

The germans were transfered away from the Eastern Front because they really seemed to sympathize with the Nazis. The "gulag" was just a jail. Those numbers are a little high compared to the numbers in jail in the US. Not sure if they are accurate. Probably not. These jails had the same sort of death rate as in US jails except during WWII during which time the USSR was having some serious troubles and i can sort of see worrying about those in jail would be a lower priority when tens of millions of civilians are being killed.

 

yes, this is mostly about the supposed ukranian genocide. This started with nazis and was picked up by Hearst. That book discredits some of it. Also Dr. Mark Tauger (who is a professor at West Virginia university) has some stuff talking about how many actually died from the famine. (There was a famine, just not remotely engineered.) And the number 7 million is grossly inflated. It seems they were trying to make sure it was above 6 million to get ahead of the Jewish holocaust. There were (If i remember correctly) around a million who died of famine though.

 

While academia, media and Hollywood rightly keep attention on the Jewish Holocaust, they ignore Ukraine. We still hunt Nazi killers but not communist killers. There are few photos of the Ukraine genocide or Stalin's gulag, and fewer living survivors. Dead men tell no tales.

Actually immediately after WWII, the US started Operation Paperclip and gave new identities to at least 1000 high ranking Nazis, so among other things they could help the US fight communism. Most notably was Adolph Eichmann, I think his name was.

[Jay]

For example:

http://www.wsws.org/articles/2006/jul2006/nazi-j03_prn.shtml

And even wikipedia (which is often very right-wing slanted) I think gives plenty that is very damming concerning Paperclip.

[Jay]

By the way, what do you think should be China's next move? They're in a tough spot...Dealing with Kim Jong-il seems to have landed in their lap again. Military response, I'm assuming is out of the question...

You know, it doesn't seem to matter -- the proposal to impose sanctions is only going to piss off J-il and, really, I don't think he gives a damn. He is already starving the People (in more ways than one); so I see him not allowing the aid -- food, services -- in to the country just to show his defiance. He just seems that kinda guy to me.

I think imposing sanctions is always a bad idea. The people of the country (whatever country) bear the brunt of the sanctions and it ultimately usually ends up in more misery than straight out violence would have. I forget exactly but I think it was 500,000 children that were killed by Iraqi sanctions from 1991 to 2000 or so, for example.

 

I haven't read enough to know what to think of Kim Jong-Il. What I have read is pretty negative. But I would really like to find a viewpoint that answers (or tries to answer) all the negative stuff. I haven't found that. I've found extreme secrecy and a sort of religion supposedly put around Jong-Il to help keep the people obedient. But then what I've read had clear reason to be biased against him so I'm not sure I trust it.

 

If they really want to stop him on the nuke thing without causing a lot of harm they should obviously actually TALK to NK. NK seems to want to talk about something. Not even talking to them seems ridiculous.

 

Other than that, I just don't know.

[Jay]

I agree with NK that it's basically a declaration of war. It's funny but I don't recall Pakistan's military dictatorship getting sanctions when they got nukes. Oh yeah, they're capitalist. Nevermind.

[_raVen_]

Well, the hypocrisy knows no bounds

If it did, UN resolutions against Israel would not have been vetoed.

[Guest]

I think in the case of North Korea the sanctions will do little to the people since the govt. doesn't give the people anything anyway. As for Iran they would work because the govt. treats you pretty well if you support the govt...and they wouldn't be able to provide for the poor in Iran if we put sanctions on them...and Iran wants to provide for the people that agree with the national idealogy

[offense74]

I think there are better ways than economic sanctions. As potter said Nort Korea seems kind of hopeless anyway since they are cut off from the rest of the world.

For Iran, instead of threatening them with war and economic sanctions it would be better to encourage the positive forces of Iran. I would like to hear Bush and EU leaders to say something like this out loud and meen it:

 

"Everyone that fights for freedom in Iran and thereby risk imprisonment by the fucktard government of Iran are welcomed with open arms to our countries, where they can keep on the struggle against the fucktards of the world."

[_raVen_]

Looks like we all agree on the sanctions resulting in more harm (or doing nothing) than good -- who'd-a-thunk?

 

Speaking of genocide, France seems to want to outlaw the denial of the Armenian Genocide While this has been an issue with me (the denial), I certainly don't believe in squashing free speech...sad, though -- sometimes the sacrifices necessary for the greater good seem too much. It peeves me, to put it mildly, that Turkey continues to maintain their rewrite of history. It's tragic for All, really, including other Peoples whose systematic executions have been denied (or just ignored, like in Darfur ); but obviously, most painful for the Armenians.

At the same time I can understand the preposterousness of such denials...but legislation is not the answer. I prefer education: we, in the U.S. are lacking in it in regard to the Armenian Holocaust as well. Some might "know" it; but it would go a long way if the government would officially acknowledge it, wouldn't one think? Shameful, shameful, shameful.

 

 

And on another dis.gusting note (Jay, I'm sure you will be quite impressed),

Bush Gets An Early Holiday Gift --Hurray for "Democracy" and "Liberty and Justice For All!

 

Jay, are you consuming greens in those blueberry smoothies? Don't worry about depending on them -- you cannot overdo blueberries. In fact, they are considered among the top five in antioxidants.

Recently, pomegranates have been shown to be up there as well; especially good for men in regard to the devastating prostate cancer epidemic. Women are being advised to consume it as well, as it is hopeful that its preventative properties will be effective against breast cancer.

Pomegranate juice -- pure, no additives -- is best. Only a cup a day is necessary, I believe. Extracts are now becoming more readily available and would probably be cheaper.

[Guest]

I think if people fought for freedom in Iran...they'd get squashed by the general public that loves the govt...lots of people love the new Iranian President

[Jay]

I really don't like trying to make it illegal to deny holocausts. For starters I'm denying the Ukranian holocaust right here. But also censoring stuff just makes people wonder if the censored view has some merit. There was a book that refuted all the Jewish holocaust denial ideas written by some frenchman. I was amazed that some people were angry with him for writing it because he "legitimized" their denials by refuting them. Censorship is always the wrong way to go about things.

 

I think there are better ways than economic sanctions. As potter said Nort Korea seems kind of hopeless anyway since they are cut off from the rest of the world.

For Iran, instead of threatening them with war and economic sanctions it would be better to encourage the positive forces of Iran. I would like to hear Bush and EU leaders to say something like this out loud and meen it:

 

"Everyone that fights for freedom in Iran and thereby risk imprisonment by the fucktard government of Iran are welcomed with open arms to our countries, where they can keep on the struggle against the fucktards of the world."

They really really hate America because they used to have a democracy until America overthrew it in 1953 and replaced it with a murderous regime that went around torturing people for many decades. The idea that the US actually wants their to be freedom in Iran doesn't pass the laugh test. So if Bush telling them to rise up.... is just not of much use. If I were them I'd probably go do the exact opposite as I'd assume he was telling them to do something that would get them slaughtered, like the US did with the Polish uprising if I remember correctly. (Tricked them into thinking they had a chance and should revolt, then left them out to hang and be slaughtered so they could have something negative to hang on the USSR).

 

raVen, problem with the greens is they go bad quick. Frozen blueberries last forever... I'll try to do better.

Pomengranite juice is pretty expensive here.

 

That's great about the torture bill. Yah for torture!! Just finished watching The Battle for Algiers. It had plenty of torture and it made me think about the parallels between the French and the US.

[_raVen_]

I really don't like trying to make it illegal to deny holocausts. For starters I'm denying the Ukranian holocaust right here. But also censoring stuff just makes people wonder if the censored view has some merit. There was a book that refuted all the Jewish holocaust denial ideas written by some frenchman. I was amazed that some people were angry with him for writing it because he "legitimized" their denials by refuting them. Censorship is always the wrong way to go about things.

 

I agree. I mean, we cannot get rid of people with whom we disagree (well, wait. Yea, We -- pick-a-gov't-"agency" -- can; but you know what I mean) as much as we may hate what they espouse. Asswipes are free to be asswipes. Goes to "freedom" at its core.

Good point about the refutations; but, then again, one has to pick their battles.

 

... If I were them I'd probably go do the exact opposite as I'd assume he was telling them to do something that would get them slaughtered, like the US did with the Polish uprising if I remember correctly. (Tricked them into thinking they had a chance and should revolt, then left them out to hang and be slaughtered so they could have something negative to hang on the USSR).

 

A la Bush Sr. to the Shi'ites. Funny how it was apparently okay to "cut and run" back in the "good war" in the Gulf, isn't it? We wouldn't want anyone to get slaughtered if we did something as monstrous as that, now would we?

The press had a lot to do with the propoganda for that war too. What's that quote... "Truth is the first casualty of war"?

 

raVen, problem with the greens is they go bad quick. Frozen blueberries last forever... I'll try to do better.

 

Unacceptable. They will not go bad if you make it in the morning and drink it later in the day. It will lose some nutrition, but no where near enough to justify abandoning them. In fact, those blueberries, stored, may have lost more.

Trying is not doing. Shape up!

 

...The Battle for Algiers. It had plenty of torture and it made me think about the parallels between the French and the US.

 

Is it not an eerie film? Everyone needs to see it.

 

...So you didn't know that show would be so much about West Virginia then?

 

No, I didn't!

 

...It's a 100 year old house that my dad bought for $750 dollars of unpaid taxes. He gave it to us. It's not much to look at but i don't mind. It's a decent neighborhood. Luckily my father-in-law has experience with this stuff and is showing my how to do stuff (install windows, doors, siding.) It slants sort of like in the Willy Wonka movie.... but the foundation is OK.

 

I actually like the way that sounds

 

-------

 

From finbarrio's blog (may as well post it here since this seems to be the makeshift political board )

 

I doubt we'll see anyone who would be up to our standards, run. Barring Al Gore (who, certainly isn't perfect and nowhere near ideal), I can't see anyone right now I'd like...perhaps Barack Obama...

 

Obama gave a great interview on Oprah yesterday -- anyone see it? If anyone is interested on why I think the above, he's also on the cover of Men's Vogue and on TIME currently.

He is also appearing on PBS's "Tavis Smiley Show," here in L.A. this Monday, October 23, which should be good; Tavis is a good interviewer. Check your local PBS listings.

Again, he's not ideal, not perfect, but as close as We are gonna get as long as he stays "green" (though certainly not naive). My guess is a run in 2012 for sure, in '08 possible.

[offense74]

Ok, so I've been to Iran and yes they hate Bush (as most of the world do). They have nothing against Americans though, infact most want to move there (or western Europe). They can get out of Iran but noone wants them, even getting a tourist visa is hard since everybody thinks they're terrorists.

Even though they hate Bush I think they hate the fucktard idiot priests governing their lifes even moore. The fucktards knows this so they have lightend things up a bit. Give it time and it will resolve. I only think progress will be a little faster if we supported the positive forces.

The ones who support the government are islamic fundamentals and poor peasants who put their faith into, well, faith. The rest of the 90% of the population think the priests are fucktards.

 

I think one have to look at Persian history to find the answere to why things are progressing slowly. Persia is like 13000 years old, for most of it's history it has been occupied by various forces that have put their culture on the Persians. One of the remarkable things when I was there though was that even through all these occupations a kind of a Persian "soul" or way of life have prevailed. The marionette government sitting in Tehran right now is not representative for the Persians who were the nicest most hospitable people I've ever met. You get invited to peoples houses like 10 times a day, it's crazy.

The last 100 years, with USA, Israel and fucktard priests is just a parenthesis in their 13000 year history. They've been here before.

In recent history the Iran Iraq conflict comes up. Noone supported Iran in that conflict. They are used to doing things by themselves.

All governments in the region blames all their problems on Israel and Bush to keep focus on other things than them stoning women to death for talking to men.

[Jay]

Obama gave a great interview on Oprah yesterday -- anyone see it? If anyone is interested on why I think the above, he's also on the cover of Men's Vogue and on TIME currently.

He is also appearing on PBS's "Tavis Smiley Show," here in L.A. this Monday, October 23, which should be good; Tavis is a good interviewer. Check your local PBS listings.

Again, he's not ideal, not perfect, but as close as We are gonna get as long as he stays "green" (though certainly not naive). My guess is a run in 2012 for sure, in '08 possible.

I don't know much about him.... but I hear he's the anti-christ.

http://www.unfogged.com/archives/week_2006_10_22.html#005644

Did anyone read the TIME Magazine article on Obama? It really creeped me out. At one of Obama's speaking engagements he was introduced in the following way: "He's all of us! He's not black! He's not white! He's not ..." The speaker then faltered and realized that she was about to say that He's not male or female. This kind of a description for anyone is worrysome. I believe that this is exactly how antichrist will be. Also, Obama announced today that he will be considering a run for president in '08. This going back on past statements that he was not interested in running. Not to mention that everything seems to be falling into place for end-times events to occur. Just my humble opinion.

 

-----

Yes, I believe he will win in 08 and we will be finished by 012. I feel in my soul that he is the AntiChrist. He's too good to believe. Where did he come from? Where did his name come from? What evil forces are behind him?

 

-----

If Barack Obama runs and wins in 08' It will truely spell the doom for America as we know it. He truely is evil. We all know this and can feel it in our bones. Shame on Time Magazine and shame on Illinois.

[Jay]

Ok, so I've been to Iran and yes they hate Bush (as most of the world do). They have nothing against Americans though, infact most want to move there (or western Europe). They can get out of Iran but noone wants them, even getting a tourist visa is hard since everybody thinks they're terrorists.

Even though they hate Bush I think they hate the fucktard idiot priests governing their lifes even moore. The fucktards knows this so they have lightend things up a bit. Give it time and it will resolve. I only think progress will be a little faster if we supported the positive forces.

The ones who support the government are islamic fundamentals and poor peasants who put their faith into, well, faith. The rest of the 90% of the population think the priests are fucktards.

 

I think one have to look at Persian history to find the answere to why things are progressing slowly. Persia is like 13000 years old, for most of it's history it has been occupied by various forces that have put their culture on the Persians. One of the remarkable things when I was there though was that even through all these occupations a kind of a Persian "soul" or way of life have prevailed. The marionette government sitting in Tehran right now is not representative for the Persians who were the nicest most hospitable people I've ever met. You get invited to peoples houses like 10 times a day, it's crazy.

The last 100 years, with USA, Israel and fucktard priests is just a parenthesis in their 13000 year history. They've been here before.

In recent history the Iran Iraq conflict comes up. Noone supported Iran in that conflict. They are used to doing things by themselves.

All governments in the region blames all their problems on Israel and Bush to keep focus on other things than them stoning women to death for talking to men.

I've never been there. I do think some countries demonize the US in order to increase solidarity among their people/distract them from the problems that they are causing all on their own.

[finbarrio]

Not to mention that everything seems to be falling into place for end-times events to occur. Just my humble opinion.

 

If it does happen I think it will be because people want it to happen - it's a self fulfilling prophesy (just my humble opinion).

I just hope I find a safe place to hide until it's all over.

[_raVen_]

Obama gave a great interview on Oprah yesterday -- anyone see it? If anyone is interested on why I think the above, he's also on the cover of Men's Vogue and on TIME currently.

He is also appearing on PBS's "Tavis Smiley Show," here in L.A. this Monday, October 23, which should be good; Tavis is a good interviewer. Check your local PBS listings.

Again, he's not ideal, not perfect, but as close as We are gonna get as long as he stays "green" (though certainly not naive). My guess is a run in 2012 for sure, in '08 possible.

I don't know much about him.... but I hear he's the anti-christ.

 

Well, I remember when Reagan was the anti-Christ -- will the real anti-Christ please stand up? Every year evangelicals claim "Armageddon." The Second Coming of Christ is supposed be "as a thief in the night"; which, has been said to mean, no one will be expecting it. So if all this is said to be occuring, it seems unlikely it is. But who knows? I guess Obama could be the anti-Christ. He would have to fulfill a lot of prophecy... and the world is pretty much exploding, with the Middle East increasingly at the center of it all.

But, from what I remember, there will be 1000 years of peace -- is it before or after he comes? Geesh, I've forgotten a lot of this! I should brush up on it.

 

If Obama is the anti-Christ, he won't get my vote

[finbarrio]

I think I'm the anti-christ.

 

(shhh, don't tell anyone).

[Jay]

Not to mention that everything seems to be falling into place for end-times events to occur. Just my humble opinion.

 

If it does happen I think it will be because people want it to happen - it's a self fulfilling prophesy (just my humble opinion).

I just hope I find a safe place to hide until it's all over.

Hey, that was me quoting some christian fundy nut. I don't believe we are nearing the christian endtimes. I do think the US is going to have a economic meltdown as we don't produce anything anymore thanks to offshoring. This means the US dollar is getting very weak and eventually people will stop investing in it. My dad is switching over to the Indian stock market for example.

 

Which is why i don't want to be dependent on blueberries for curing my insomnia. I don't think I'll have access to unlimited frozen blueberries one of these days. I do plan on planting a bunch of blueberry bushes but they don't thrive this far north.

[Guest]

I know that the econimic downfalls of the US in the past have always weekened the world economy but this time I think it will be different. If/when our economy fails I believe the rest of the world will benefit from it and it will be worth biting the bullet even though it will suck