Jump to content

State of the Union Undress- PETA


xveganjoshx
 Share

Recommended Posts

  • Replies 66
  • Created
  • Last Reply

Top Posters In This Topic

He does raise some good points and they make sense to some extent but the simple fact that women are at the point where men aren't making what they do to speak out illegal shows that women aren't as dis empowered as one might think. Most PETA employees are women(by far) and no matter how much you deny it PETA has educated more people to veganism than anyone else. If it works I say do it. The people that get scared off are worth it due to how many people follow.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Wow cant say I would put it past PETA. This shit is so far over the fucking top its not funny. A womens body is a beautiful thing, and that woman is very pretty. However that is total objectification and its somehow justified because it is promoting animal rights? I am sorry people that is just sad. I am by no means a prude or anti- sex or anti-nudity for that matter. However there is something about using beautiful, young concerned women and abusing there compassion in this way that is just plain wrong.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Who said the women are being used or abused ? You make it sound like they have no choice in the matter !!

 

It really annoys me that people assume women who take off their clothes to promote something/model do so under pressure or are being exploited. Its their bodies to do with as they please and I for one would happily strip off for PETA if they asked me ..

 

does that make me used and abused

 

NO !

 

Give women of today some credit for actually being able to make choices about THEIR body and what they do with it

 

Rant over

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I don't know why people (especially men) thinks women are some mindless, fragile robots that we strong men need to protect. Most women I've met have not been like that.

 

PETA is the biggest organization when it comes to this matter. They are the biggest because of the way they work. It's obviously somehow efficient since alot of people have made positive decisions when it comes to lifestyle thanks in part at least to PETA. I believe that there are hundreds of poltically correct feminist, anarcho or whatever organizations that have a wet dream of animal liberation. Noone has ever heard of them though.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Wow cant say I would put it past PETA. This shit is so far over the fucking top its not funny. A womens body is a beautiful thing, and that woman is very pretty. However that is total objectification and its somehow justified because it is promoting animal rights? I am sorry people that is just sad. I am by no means a prude or anti- sex or anti-nudity for that matter. However there is something about using beautiful, young concerned women and abusing there compassion in this way that is just plain wrong.

 

++. Agreed.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I really wish I could articulate myself as beautifully and clearly as some philosphers can. For those of you who haven't read what Francione has to say on the matter, check it out here, because it really is very relevant to the promotion of veganism.

 

The State of the Movement

 

Speciesism is wrong because, like racism, sexism, and homophobia, it excludes sentient beings from full membership in the moral community based on an irrelevant characteristic. Race, sex, sexual orientation, and species are all irrelevant to the capacity to be harmed.

 

But the rejection of speciesism on this ground implies the rejection of discrimination based on race, sex, or sexual orientation. It is unacceptable to perpetuate the commodification of one group for the benefit of another. Commodification involves treating the other—whether a woman, person of color, gay or lesbian, or nonhuman—as an object, as something rather than as someone.

 

For many years, People for the Ethical Treatment of Animals has promoted sexist campaigns. This started with their “I’d rather go naked than wear fur” campaign in the early 1990s and has “progressed” through a series of increasing cheap and puerile promotions, culminating in its most recent PETA’s State of the Union Undress, which hits new lows, even for PETA.

 

And that’s saying something for an organization that has done its best to reduce the serious issue of animal exploitation to a bunch of locker room jokes.

 

We’ve now gone to full frontal (and shaved) female nudity—“for the animals.” You must first click to signify that you are over 18. And after you watch a woman strip completely while she tells you all about PETA’s welfarist campaigns designed to get you to consume with “compassion,” you see several minutes of gory photos of nonhumans being exploited in various contexts. The video ends with a quotation from Dr. Martin Luther King about justice. It’s really multiple levels of pornography.

 

This most recent video, although more extreme than past PETA efforts in this regard, is problematic for the reasons that all of PETA’s sexist and misogynistic campaigns are problematic.

 

First, these campaigns commodify a traditionally disempowered group (women) as a supposed means to the end of helping another disempowered group (nonhumans). But what sense does it make to say that we should treat one group instrumentally in order to help another group? It does not make any sense whatsoever. Indeed, by encouraging the public to see women as objects, PETA merely ensures that people will continue to see nonhumans as objects. As long as we continue to treat women like meat, we will continue to treat nonhumans as meat.

 

It is imperative that we object to the instrumental treatment of any group. Devaluing and commodifying one group for the supposed benefit of another is immoral and self-defeating.

 

Second, by coupling sexual imagery with images of violence toward nonhumans, these campaigns attempt to eroticize animal exploitation. We live in a culture in which violence, and particularly violence against women, is eroticized in a variety of ways. Perpetuating this, and extending it to the exploitation of nonhumans, is deeply troubling.

 

Third, these campaigns have everything to do with promoting PETA and nothing to do with the exploitation of nonhuman animals. PETA started its naked fur campaign in the early 1990s. The fur industry is stronger than ever. There has been a dramatic increase in the past decade in the number of stores carrying fur and the number of designers using fur combined with a significant drop in the average age of fur buyers. A 2004 Gallup poll “found that 63 percent of respondents pronounced the buying and wearing of clothing made with animal fur ‘morally acceptable.’” Although good results for nonhumans would not justify sexism, sexism has not produced any good results for nonhumans.

 

Fourth, these campaigns will do nothing to encourage serious discussion about the exploitation of nonhumans, including the importance of veganism, the problems with animal welfare, the property status of nonhumans, speciesist thinking, etc. Rather, they will cause any thinking person who is not already convinced to dismiss the “movement” as stupid, offensive, and juvenile. It is no wonder that other political progressives shun the “movement.”

 

The idea that PETA thinks it appropriate to end a striptease video with a quote from Martin Luther King about injustice is further indication that PETA is willing to trivialize anything and anyone in its relentless attempt to promote itself. Perhaps PETA should recall that Dr. King significantly advanced the cause of justice through intellect, tenacity, dignity and courage and without ever “going naked” to win civil rights or engaging in any of the sensationalism and tawdry cheapness that has become PETA’s trademark.

 

I have been critical of PETA’s sexism from the very beginning of these campaigns in the early 1990s. And every time that I have raised this issue with various PETAphiles, including Ingrid Newkirk, I have been told that there is nothing wrong with these campaigns because the women involved participate willingly and that it is an expression of feminism to go naked “for the animals.” That is as ridiculous as saying that the African-American actors who perpetuated racist stereotypes in blackface comedies in the 1920s and 1930s were striking a blow for racial equality. The fact that this exploitation is “victim approved” does not mean it is not exploitation. It just means that sexism is so pervasive in our society that many women are blinded to it. That should come as no surprise.

 

Those of you who regard PETA as “radical” need to rethink your understanding of that term. Being “radical” involves going to the root or the source. A radical solution is one that goes to the root of the problem and proposes a fundamental shift. PETA’s campaigns are indistinguishable from traditional animal welfare approaches. The fact that PETA also promotes sexism and tries to offend anyone that it can just to get media attention does not make it “radical.” PETA is not acting to change the prevailing paradigm of speciesist hierarchy and oppression—it is reinforcing that paradigm.

 

PETA may have started as a worthwhile organization, but it has become an end in itself and exploited nonhumans are merely “props” in an endless series of self-promotions that have turned PETA into a multi-million dollar organization that has abandoned any claim to be abolitionist in any serious sense. PETA is hindering, and not helping, the cause of animal rights. If you are a PETA supporter, you should think about whether to continue that support.

 

But then, if PETA’s giving an award to “visionary” slaughterhouse designer and animal exploiter Temple Grandin, or PETA’s position that animal rights means dead animals, did not cause you to come to the conclusion that Newkirk and her friends have gone so far astray as to have lost the path entirely, then perhaps a full frontal striptease performed by a woman extolling the virtues of animal welfare juxtaposed with scenes of animal exploitation and ending with Dr. Martin Luther King will not bother you either.

 

Gary L. Francione

© 2007 Gary L. Francione

From http://garyfrancione.blogspot.com/2007/01/state-of-movement.html

Link to comment
Share on other sites

1. The author sees women as mindless robots that men need to set right, since they cannot make their own decisions. It is also our duty to protect women from any harm since they are uncapable of that too.

2. I don't like the way most people view animals but to say that they should be full members of the moral community is just plain nonsense. You want to take a mosquito to trial because it gave someone malaria?

3. Treating animals as commodities is wrong because they are not part of the moral community and most of them can't make the choice of whether they want to sell their labour to anyone or not. Again, not so with women (or men). It's not my choce to decide what other people should do with their life and time on this earth.

4. How's violence against women eroticised? No explanation in the article that I can see. Maybe the author finds it erotic? I don't.

5. Is PETA to blame for people buyin fur? C'mon!? Why not blame ALF, Cheney or spaceships instead?

6. To say that people are not discussing or are positively influenced by PETA's information is simply inaccurate and has no ground.

 

To me the whole article is just mumbo-jumbo.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I agree with that. To many men(philosophers especially) try to tell women what to do. Well they used to get away with that but now women have rights so screw the philosophers. Maybe this isn't the perfect way to do things but its obvious that what PETA does works. We'll see if it keeps working. I think it will. I really think if PETA never exhisted we wouldn't be in the place we are now. Who knows...maybe even less than half of us wouldn't even be vegan....maybe even more than that. Not that PETA influenced all of us directly but they did influence the movement and make it much larger than it was.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Who said the women are being used or abused ? You make it sound like they have no choice in the matter !!

 

It really annoys me that people assume women who take off their clothes to promote something/model do so under pressure or are being exploited. Its their bodies to do with as they please and I for one would happily strip off for PETA if they asked me ..

 

does that make me used and abused

 

NO !

 

Give women of today some credit for actually being able to make choices about THEIR body and what they do with it

 

Rant over

 

 

And if I may add:

In order to agree with Francione's extremely narrow-minded rebuttal, one would have to first agree that the naked human body is, in and of itself, a sexual object. And that any woman who willingly shows off her naked body is a victim of misogyny. Of course, PETA knows that because our society has become so religiously zealous and puritanical, their spot would be viewed as something sexual and deviant, and thus shocking. And so by being shocked or repulsed by it, you're not only playing into PETA's hands, you're playing into the narrow-minded, religiously zealous majority in this country who want to control how you view something as natural as a naked human.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I didn't think about that part. Its kinda like the people complaining with all their will about women showing their sex parts when breast feeding. Little do most men know...breasts aren't really a sex part(well there not supposed to be ). Nobody ever complains about a man being shirtless...lots of people complain about women wearing sports bras or tight shirts.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

they do it under false pretenses, they think they are helping animals and promoting a good cause. They arent. I am sorry shit like that does nothing for veganism.

 

Oh right, and you now speak for every woman in the land do you as you can obviously read our minds and know whats best for us !!! I find your comment very offensive as you are insinuating that women don't know their own minds.

 

Its our bodies to do with as we please !!! How we choose to promote anything is up to US - or are we not intelligent enough to make decisions about our bodies ? !

Link to comment
Share on other sites

they do it under false pretenses, they think they are helping animals and promoting a good cause. They arent. I am sorry shit like that does nothing for veganism.

 

Oh right, and you now speak for every woman in the land do you as you can obviously read our minds and know whats best for us !!! I find your comment very offensive as you are insinuating that women don't know their own minds.

 

Its our bodies to do with as we please !!! How we choose to promote anything is up to US - or are we not intelligent enough to make decisions about our bodies ? !

 

 

bullshit, get offended makes no difference to me. This woman isn't a Porn Star. I would bet that she would never be involved in the Porn Industry. She isnt choosing to pose nude as a career. She is choosing to do so because she thinks it is helping save animals. Can you honestly tell me that a young girl stripping down naked on a video is going to make people go vegan? Give me a break. I am not going to sit here and debate porn, I am simply arguing that using a woman's body as an object to promote animal rights is wrong. Did you ever hear me say that it wasnt your choice? Did you ever hear me say that women arent intelligent? Dont put fucking words in my mouth to get your point across that is just being plain dishonest.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Very grown up ... resorting to using abusive language to get your point across!!

 

When you can debate like an adult get back to me and we can continue. Until then I will ignore you

 

Right, you cant even debate without making shit up, and putting words in my mouth. Youre only pissed because you show skin to get attention on the internet. Get over yourself

Link to comment
Share on other sites

obviously she was doing that for attention, and that's what PETA is all about, they get our attention and then they try to educate us... i don't care if they have naked men or women running around, as long as people are thinking and are conscient about it.. 'the end justifies the means'... ( of course there are exceptions.. )

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Obviously there intent is to get attention. I just dont see how using sex in that way to promote veganism is something we as a community can promote as positive. By making that AD in that way they are attempting to rely the fact that men who do objectify women will watch the AD and in turn become educated about veganism. This just seems very backwards to me, coming from a progressive movement that promotes equality.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I just think if attention isn't made that way there may be no attention paid to vegans at all. Just look at promoting veganism through fitness. People don't think vegans can be muscular since most vegans aren't(as most people aren't) but if normal healthy vegans go out promoting health people won't listen. But if a lightly steroid pumped vegan goes out promoting health people will listen. I know the cases are different but getting people to at least observe the movement is better than nothing.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Obviously there intent is to get attention. I just dont see how using sex in that way to promote veganism is something we as a community can promote as positive. By making that AD in that way they are attempting to rely the fact that men who do objectify women will watch the AD and in turn become educated about veganism. This just seems very backwards to me, coming from a progressive movement that promotes equality.

 

i know, it's bad for our ( or PETA's ) reputation ( the one that we probably never had ), but the video is so insane ( or crazy, retarded, i don't know the right word )..that even meat eaters will promote the video in order to make fun of PETA..

in the end, a lot of people will watch the video..

it works, but it's not good for our reputation..

and personally, i think PETA should try to promote ''physical'' activism, instead of wasting their money w/ shitty campaigns.

 

and you're right veganpotter.

 

veganpotter, do you know vegans who use steroids?

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Howdy All,

It's great to see folks discussing & thinking about this! While it's also great that folks have strong opinions/feelings on these issues, let's be sure that we keep this discussion polite & respectful. A good start is to drop the namecalling & personal attacks - try to assume the best about our friends here & their intentions. People are usually a lot more receptive & likely to consider your opinion if they dont feel like they are being attacked....

Edited by loveliberate
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Not a Francione fan.

 

To accept his argument, I would need to accept that the woman is being treated (as he put it) "as an object, as something rather than as someone." Maybe she is, maybe she isn't. I'd like that expressed, not merely assumed.

 

He's also making a logically shaky statement by saying: "Third, these campaigns have everything to do with promoting PETA and nothing to do with the exploitation of nonhuman animals. PETA started its naked fur campaign in the early 1990s. The fur industry is stronger than ever."

 

That first statement is pure speculation; he's injecting his opinion. The second and third statements look to establish lack of efficacy based on minimal evidence. There could be any number of factors involved in the "strength of the fur industry." Perhaps one is simply population growth (not making that argument, just showing that he is oversimplifying).

 

And referring to PeTA as a "welfarist" organization is an ad hominem (It's one of his favorite tactics).

 

Again, I'm not a fan. Just because he says something with conviction doesn't mean his logic is strong.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

This is a heated subject, but let's try to put our views across without hostility to one another.

 

I think that nudity in itself isn't a bad thing. But I think this video just doesn't work. It makes me sad to see this kind of speech accompanied by a strip show. I understand the point of it, but I think it's just a bit kind of sick really, I dunno.

 

Imagine a missing child report, where the news reporter is taking their clothes off. It would get people's attention sure, but something about it seems creepy to me.

 

Also, I don't necessarily think that this particular woman was taken advantage of, she may well have been happy to take part in it. But I think it detracts from what she is saying more than anything, and it's almost being presented like what she is saying wouldn't be worth it without the nudity.

 

I turned it off once she had took off her shirt, I found it depressing. I am not embarrassed by nudity, but this combination seems upsetting and awkward.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now
 Share




×
×
  • Create New...