Jump to content

Do You Ever Cheat?


veggieprincess
 Share

Recommended Posts

I don't think it's rude if you ask politely. I also don't think it's rude to not have anything if you don't want to.

 

What I think is rude is to force something on someone, or if the host would be angry cause you don't want what they offer.

 

If I offer something to a guest it's an offer, not an obligation.

It would be very rude to force anything onto a geust!

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Replies 99
  • Created
  • Last Reply

Top Posters In This Topic

yeah, the motive for avoiding meat and dairy is of great significance. If it's just health, you sometimes allow to yourself to be harmed. But if it's A/R then you couldn't compromise.

 

Personally i've become a vegan (or, i-just-avoid-eating-meat-and-dairy, if you want) for health reasons as i was really sick. After i bounced back with the vegan diet, i realized the implications of meat-dairy eating to the environment, nature and yes, to animals too. My primary concern isn't animals, but i do understand that meat and dairy is not food for human consumption. I try to eat raw vegan as much as i can, to get those 2-3 times of cheating/year out of my system for good. And yes, when i do cheat, i feel terribly in my stomach too (but i don't know if that's just "power of suggestion" or something....)

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Sadly, I am still vegetarian and have not yet made that full leap to vegan. I became a vegetarian almost 5 years ago and I can say that I've never knowingly cheated. My husband got me started on vegetarianism however he had a very poor diet so I do have to say that I have focused more on the health aspect of it rather than the A/R. That's shameful to admit because I do feel very strongly about A/R but I do eat the occasional organic free range egg or organic cheese and yogurt. These three things have been very hard for me to break away from.

 

If anyone can recommend good replacements for these items I would greatly appreciate it!

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Sadly, I am still vegetarian and have not yet made that full leap to vegan. I became a vegetarian almost 5 years ago and I can say that I've never knowingly cheated. My husband got me started on vegetarianism however he had a very poor diet so I do have to say that I have focused more on the health aspect of it rather than the A/R. That's shameful to admit because I do feel very strongly about A/R but I do eat the occasional organic free range egg or organic cheese and yogurt. These three things have been very hard for me to break away from.

 

If anyone can recommend good replacements for these items I would greatly appreciate it!

 

I understand. Dairy is addictive as it contains casein. There is always soy milk, almond milk (you can make it so easy by yourself), rice milk etc etc.

 

There is also soy cheese and tofu and you can have vegan pizzas with soy cheese

 

Concerning eggs, i never liked eating them even when i was an omni. Eggs are the chicken's menstruation. If the egg is inseminated then we eat a potential embryo. If it's not, then it's period.

 

IMO, animal milk isn't made for human consumption. only to think of it it's so unatural. we're supposed to drink our mother's milk when we're babies just like every other mammal.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

And lets say this is my 102nd meal in a 17 day period, so 99.9% of my meals in the past 17 days have been Vegan but this one meal I am taking in 1/18 of a teaspoon of animal product in the form of Casein or Whey.... I am suddenly not allowed to call myself Vegan?

 

Shouldn't it be about living up to a standard as often as possible but allowing some room for error?

 

No offense, but if you're consuming animalproducts then you are not a vegan. Even if it is just a teaspoon. In my humble opinion you can still call yourself a vegan if you slip up sometimes, but then you're not willingly consuming animalproducts.

 

That being said, every effort towards veganism should be applauded. The label 'vegan' is not neccesary to strive towards a cruelty free world.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I'm out somewhere that someone else prepared the food. I don't want to be rude and I'm not comfortable drawing attention to myself that way, I hate the idea of being a pain to others. I am usually good about picking something that is possibly vegan, but I don't grill the server or party hostess on whether or not the pasta was made with eggs, the bread with milk, the veggies have butter, etc.

 

 

I agree that this is hard sometimes, especially if someone put an effort into preparing a meal for you. Best thing to do, is to tell people in advance to avoid having to turn down anything on the spot. Whenever I have to eat out (mostly family gatherings) I always offer to do (part of)the cooking. This way you can turn a negative into a positive, and it's also a great way to show people how tasty vegan food can be

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Room for error is for accidents like something being mislabeled or wrongly believing something is vegan. If you know its not vegan and you eat eat they you should know you are not vegan. As for eating as vegan as possible I don't know of a single person here that has had to eat a non vegan item because they had no choice. This means a gun to your head or maybe if you haven't eaten for a week and a glass of milk is the only calorie source thats gonna be available to you then maybe you have no choice but in the real world...you have a choice...especially in a modern nation.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

As for eating as vegan as possible I don't know of a single person here that has had to eat a non vegan item because they had no choice.

 

About a year ago I took some heavy duty medication to which there was no vegan alternative. It sucked, but I didn't think twice about it. Although I did have a choice, the alternative (not taking any medication) was not a real option to me.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

About a year ago I took some heavy duty medication to which there was no vegan alternative. It sucked, but I didn't think twice about it. Although I did have a choice, the alternative (not taking any medication) was not a real option to me.

 

That's a situation nobody can be faulted for. I have had to get multiple eye surgeries in the past few months and have medications injected directly into the eye that I know were animal tested, but if I were to refuse, I can pretty well be assured that I will be 80% blind within the next few years. That's not an option, it's a necessity for me to get it done. I'd do not good as a blind martyr who could say "At least I didn't use any animal-derived medications!" So, sometimes you've just got to suck it up with special circumstances and accept that there can occasionally be a necessary evil to contend with.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

About a year ago I took some heavy duty medication to which there was no vegan alternative. It sucked, but I didn't think twice about it. Although I did have a choice, the alternative (not taking any medication) was not a real option to me.

 

That's a situation nobody can be faulted for. I have had to get multiple eye surgeries in the past few months and have medications injected directly into the eye that I know were animal tested, but if I were to refuse, I can pretty well be assured that I will be 80% blind within the next few years. That's not an option, it's a necessity for me to get it done. I'd do not good as a blind martyr who could say "At least I didn't use any animal-derived medications!" So, sometimes you've just got to suck it up with special circumstances and accept that there can occasionally be a necessary evil to contend with.

 

Exactly, you running an online business, and showing that vegan powerlifters can be taken seriously, but having to use something animal tested, and feeling bad about it, is two steps forward and one step back, you're still doing good for "the cause".

Link to comment
Share on other sites

And lets say this is my 102nd meal in a 17 day period, so 99.9% of my meals in the past 17 days have been Vegan but this one meal I am taking in 1/18 of a teaspoon of animal product in the form of Casein or Whey.... I am suddenly not allowed to call myself Vegan?

 

Shouldn't it be about living up to a standard as often as possible but allowing some room for error?

 

No offense, but if you're consuming animalproducts then you are not a vegan. Even if it is just a teaspoon. In my humble opinion you can still call yourself a vegan if you slip up sometimes, but then you're not willingly consuming animalproducts.

 

That being said, every effort towards veganism should be applauded. The label 'vegan' is not neccesary to strive towards a cruelty free world.

 

True, the word vegan isn't necessary to strive towads a cruelty free world. But, people everywhere in this disconnected modern society are looking for a place to call home, an extended family to be a part of. As long as veganism remains a cult of a few personal purists, it will be forever be disregarded by the general population. Fortunately, the majority of vegans that I know are more progressive and inclusive. The goal is to stop the slaughter one meal at a time. The more people that can be included the better.

 

Veganism is essentially a religion, there being nothing other than "faith" to support the idea that killing animals is wrong. It's just something that those of us who get it, know to be true. Like many religions, veganism was founded, shaped and formed by a small group of radicals. That is awesome as movements don't form without such people.

 

Ultimately though, every religion expands from the tiny insular world of it's founders. You end up with your protestants and catholics, orthodox and reformed jews, sunis and shiites etc. I see this happening with veganism. The orthodox vegans are as strong as ever, but are everyday becoming a minority within a minority. There is a strong and inclusive vegan reform movement underway that the orthodox refuse to see or acknowledge.

 

Anyway, I'll stop rambling. I love all of you including those who have the occassional 1/8th teaspoon of whey and those of you who don't.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Yes, to michael!

We live in an empire that fights nature. The better and more effective we are within that context the sooner we will crash and the harder the crash will be. Expert and scientists in basically all fields dealing with reality knows this.

Along the way we are hurting animals and living systems like never before. To not eat them is just easing the consequences of our lifestyles a bit. Veganism is to me not an end in itself. Nature will take care of it eventually but in the meanwhile to lessen the burden on our surroundings we can lessen the consumption of animal products but since it is not an end in itself, small amounts of whatever animal product might be less hurtful to the system as a whole than some dye in ice cream for example.

In my opinion veganism is an unnatural measure in an unnatural time.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I understand. Dairy is addictive as it contains casein. There is always soy milk, almond milk (you can make it so easy by yourself), rice milk etc etc.

 

There is also soy cheese and tofu and you can have vegan pizzas with soy cheese

 

Concerning eggs, i never liked eating them even when i was an omni. Eggs are the chicken's menstruation. If the egg is inseminated then we eat a potential embryo. If it's not, then it's period.

 

IMO, animal milk isn't made for human consumption. only to think of it it's so unatural. we're supposed to drink our mother's milk when we're babies just like every other mammal.

 

 

I don't drink milk, only soymilk. Can you recommend a good brand of vegan cheese? Now that you've described eggs to me like that, I don't think I can ever look at them the same again!

 

That along with David's video of the Woodstock Farm Sanctuary has given me enough feul to take that final leap! Thanks, I needed that!

Link to comment
Share on other sites

 

 

I don't drink milk, only soymilk. Can you recommend a good brand of vegan cheese? Now that you've described eggs to me like that, I don't think I can ever look at them the same again!

 

That along with David's video of the Woodstock Farm Sanctuary has given me enough feul to take that final leap! Thanks, I needed that!

 

I don't know what soy cheese brands exist in the States but i would listen to veganpotter suggestions

 

I'm glad that you can see eggs as what they really are and that you've decided to try a vegan diet

Link to comment
Share on other sites

michael hobson i love you!

 

i think the puritan attitude is isolating.

 

plus i dont get the comparing it to sex thing. a virgin who has sex sometimes, virginity is a one time thing. veganism is a journey, and a process, and the approach i take to influencing people is to tell them that its one step at a time, make conscious food choices, and every little bit helps. None of my close friends are vegan but they are eating quite a few vegan meals a week. The world is never gonna be vegan but the more people can be exposed to the ideas of veganism, and the implications of their food choices, and awesome vegan food, the better things will be. You can't expect people to be open minded if you yourself are not.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Becoming a vegan may be a journey but you aren't vegan until you get there. If you start measuring how vegan someone is then you can say someone on the Atkins diet is 5% vegan...no way. As for things coming from a source...that source is coming from a human with a diet in general...there aren't really breakdowns of a vegan lifestyle because you are a vegan or you are not.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Yes, but then, if you are already a VEGAN, it means that it's not only about food. Lots of stuff that we buy arent vegan. We don't know always. If you are a true, absolute VEGAN, good for you. I'm gonna have you as a role model (concerning vegan lifestyle), and strive to be like you one day when i work with myself a bit more to build a stronger character. This is not a purity contest. Veganism is my ideal. I'll always strive to be there. But so far i should better say that i just don't eat meat and dairy.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

From the UK Vegan Society...

 

Q: What is a vegan?

 

A: A vegan is someone who tries to avoid - as far as is possible and practical - all forms of exploitation of animals for food, clothing or any other purpose. This is for the benefit of people, animals and the environment. Vegan eat a plant-based diet free from all animal products, such as meat, animal milks, eggs, honey and gelatine. They also avoid animal products like leather, wool and silk for clothing or other purposes.

 

I think the main difference of opinion on this thread is based on the very subjective idea of what is "practical". Practicality varies widely depending on geographic location, family situation, social circle, economic standing, current state of mental health and the ultimate variable of personal opinion.

 

Speaking of opinions, I find it difficult to take seriously the water-bottle-toting athletic types who declare sugar non-vegan. If sugar isn't vegan then water filtered through the same animal bone charcoal filters isn't either. While we're at it let's throw away our cars, computers, bicycles, shoes etc.

 

I prefer Vegan Actions stance...

 

Again, we recommend that vegans concentrate their attention on the most obvious animal ingredients. In our experience, concentrating on processing or on trace ingredients can make a vegan diet appear exceedingly difficult and dissuade people from adopting it.

 

Sorry, but I see "vegan" as a practical commitment to reduce animal suffering. The more people that can be included and brought down this path the better. In a world filled with animal products, there is no holy grail at the end of the path. There is no real point when you have officially arrived and are now "vegan".

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Evian is pretty much the only company that filters with bone char...pretty much all municipal water is filtered through electronic proccesses. And sure if you have no choice but to consume sugary drinks then fine but Coke has no refined sugar so if you live in a world where you can only get Pepsi then drink it if you really need to. But realistically what situation have you been where you needed refined sugar. I understand the idea of needing something to survive that the govt. required to be tested on animals but refined sugar??? We'd all be better off if that crap never existed. As for those other things you mentioned we shouldn't be driving cars being on computers...even if animals weren't involved. The world would be a better place without these things that cause so much pollution. The thing is...these things aren't so easy to control. In this world its hard to not have a job and be taken seriously trying to promote a less cruel lifestyle, however not eating refined sugar thats terrible for you should be really easy.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Yes, a sugar debate would require it's own thread. Brimac Carbon Services www.brimacservices.com in the UK is one of the world's leading suppliers of bone char for both sugar refining and water filtration. Bone char isn't produced in the U.S. or with bones from the U.S. According to Brimac and the U.S. sugar industry the bones are not slaughterhouse byproducts at all, but are from cows that died of natural causes in places like India. Personally, I think they are making that part up!

 

Regardless, none of that was the point. The point is that no single person sets the standard of what is vegan and what isn't. Even the Vegan Society UK, whose founders coined the term vegan, ask that vegans "try to avoid - as far as possible and practical" all animal products. What is practical to you isn't to someone else and it is the whole culture of vegans who ultimately define the term vegan, not a few purists.

 

As for the "need" for sugar, there isn't one. Nor is there a "need" for organic broccoli which is fertlized with manure, bone meal, blood meal and fish emulsion. Yet, you see vegans far and wide praising organic agriculture. The problem here is defining the line you draw for the pursuit of pure veganism. The farther you take it, the more people you alienate. Unfortunately those people don't just start eating sugar or honey, they often lapse altogether back in to the more culturally acceptable vegetarian or omnivore classes. The personal purity of a few is not going to save the animals, the collective best effort of the masses will.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Yes, a sugar debate would require it's own thread. Brimac Carbon Services www.brimacservices.com in the UK is one of the world's leading suppliers of bone char for both sugar refining and water filtration. Bone char isn't produced in the U.S. or with bones from the U.S. According to Brimac and the U.S. sugar industry the bones are not slaughterhouse byproducts at all, but are from cows that died of natural causes in places like India. Personally, I think they are making that part up!

 

Regardless, none of that was the point. The point is that no single person sets the standard of what is vegan and what isn't. Even the Vegan Society UK, whose founders coined the term vegan, ask that vegans "try to avoid - as far as possible and practical" all animal products. What is practical to you isn't to someone else and it is the whole culture of vegans who ultimately define the term vegan, not a few purists.

 

As for the "need" for sugar, there isn't one. Nor is there a "need" for organic broccoli which is fertlized with manure, bone meal, blood meal and fish emulsion. Yet, you see vegans far and wide praising organic agriculture. The problem here is defining the line you draw for the pursuit of pure veganism. The farther you take it, the more people you alienate. Unfortunately those people don't just start eating sugar or honey, they often lapse altogether back in to the more culturally acceptable vegetarian or omnivore classes. The personal purity of a few is not going to save the animals, the collective best effort of the masses will.

 

VERY well said hobs.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now
 Share




×
×
  • Create New...