Buddhism

[JW]

“We live in illusion and the appearance of things. There is a reality. We are that reality. When you understand this, you see that you are nothing, and being nothing, you are everything. That is all.”

Kalu Rinpoche

[Gaia]

We don't live in illusion and the appearance of things. There is no reality. We are not that reality. When you don't understand this, you see that you are something, and being something, you are nothing. That is not all.

 

The flip side , is it the same?

[jonzen]

Yes. Only opposite.

[Gaia]

Yes I stated the opposite.

Are you agreeing that it is the same?

Or are you agreeing that it is the opposite?

[jonzen]

Yes and no.

 

You see, the more I understand, the less I know. Or the more I know, the less I understand. So placing the Rinpoche's statement in reverse works for me also.

 

I grasp the idea that we are nothing, and therefore, all. I think about dreams and how real they seem to me, little difference between them and "real" life. Are we not made of the same material as everything around us.....the same material that is what we call the Universe? When I sit zazen for long periods the sense of difference from what is "me" and what is "other" begins to blur. I sense a oneness. Do you sense this also?

[JW]

Yes and no.

 

You see, the more I understand, the less I know. Or the more I know, the less I understand. So placing the Rinpoche's statement in reverse works for me also.

 

I grasp the idea that we are nothing, and therefore, all. I think about dreams and how real they seem to me, little difference between them and "real" life. Are we not made of the same material as everything around us.....the same material that is what we call the Universe? When I sit zazen for long periods the sense of difference from what is "me" and what is "other" begins to blur. I sense a oneness. Do you sense this also?

 

Very well stated jonzen!!!

And it's great to see you back posting here!

 

Reading your above post brought back a strong memory to me.

I remember coming to that same realization that we are made from the same material as everything else in the universe and feeling an overwhelming feeling of calm and "oneness"

It's a difficult feeling to describe ......

[jonzen]

Thank you my friend JW. Deepest Bows to you.

 

Yes, this blurring of "reality" seems to be increasing in me. For example, right now, as I type into my laptop, I see, outside my windows, great white cumulous clouds slowly drifting by. Without leaving my laptop, I gaze out at the clouds and sense what it is to be a water molecule suspended in air, I "see" my dwelling from the point of view of the cloud.....and the division between us is nil. I love this. I love loving all things and marvelling at the great diversity.

 

I wish those of us here who are interested in the Buddhist path could sit together in meditation some day. It would be an honor to be with all of you.

[JW]

That would be a wonderful experience to meet in meditation.

 

I really must find more time to meditate. The busy schedules of work and family tend to make it harder for me to get into a routine.

 

jonzen, how often and how long to you meditate for?

[jonzen]

You know, I think my life has come to a place where I often sit in a meditative state of mind. I think it used to be called "daydreaming"!

 

But, yes, even my painting is often meditative in nature.......being aware in the present moment.......not really "thinking" at all, just being awake and very present.

 

I sit zazen once a week, on Monday evenings, with a small group of friends who practice various paths or versions of Buddhism. I suggested we call our little sangha, "The Maxi Paths". We sit 2 sessions of 30 minutes with one walking meditation of 10 minutes between the sits. Then we commune afterwards for awhile.

 

Sometimes I go on a weekend retreat......often they are completely silent with long periods of sitting. On January 4,5,6, I will go to Great Vow Monastery in Clatskanie, Oregon, for a retreat that also includes study with the Japanese Master calligrapher Kaz Tanahashi.

 

The longest retreat thus far was a week with Thich Nhat Hanh...completely silent except for personal talks with some of the Monks or Nuns.

[JW]

I am very intrigued by the weekend retreat. I haven't attended one yet, but I know one will be in my future.

How was your first experience at a retreat?

I have spoken to people who have thoroughly enjoyed them and to those who just could not stand the silence.

 

I'd be interested in hearing about your experience and thoughts.

[suz]

Heya folks,

I just wanted to clearly say that my previous comments in this thread were intended solely as humor - I apologize if anyone finds them disrespectful towards Buddhism and/or Buddhists.

 

I'll try not to be so literal in the future.

 

 

JW: Why do you say-

"Commercialism attacks us from every angle"

IMO this sounds like what a victim would say.

 

I would also say that every generation thinks they have more and more temptations than the last one. It is still the same, just different packaging. Attachments to materialism is the same, time has no favorites.

 

It seems to me that we live an age of immense ego and selfishness. Advertising today preys on the self. I'm sure it did in the past aswell, but it's really getting pervasive -- from the ipod, to myspace.

 

On a different note, Jonzen, your upcoming retreat sounds fantastic. I'll have to go on one someday. I can't wait to hear how it goes.

[Guest]

You know, I think my life has come to a place where I often sit in a meditative state of mind. I think it used to be called "daydreaming"!

 

When I was in high school I used to meditate all the time to help with my focus in Track and Field but the more I got into my pottery the less I've caught myself needing to do it. I haven't meditated more than once a month for over a year and a half...sitting on the wheel seems to be enough for me. I just loose myself in it. Honestly...if it weren't for jerks on the road I'd probably be able to do this on my bike too...I've caught myself not focusing on where I was going numerous times on very quiet roads only to get buzzed by some 18 wheeler. The times its happened have all been quite nice other than the near death experience that breaks the calm.

[JW]

I can relate to what you are saying veganpotter. I used to get the same feeling when running long distance.

I agree that biking would be a bit on the dangerous side though

[Guest]

I'm only starting to get that feeling from running...once I get it it'll really help my cycling

[JW]

I'm just starting to read "Buddha" by Karen Armstrong.

Not too sure what to expect here. It is a biography which attempts to explore what life was really like in that day and age for the Buddha.

 

Has anyone read it?

[JW]

The Muddy Road

 

 

Tanzan and Ekido were once travelling together down a muddy road. A heavy rain was still falling.

Coming around a bend, they met a lovely girl in a silk kimono and sash, unable to cross the intersection.

"Come on, girl," said Tanzan at once. Lifting her in his arms, he carried her over the mud.

Ekido did not speak again until that night when they reached a lodging temple. Then he no longer could restrain himself. "We monks don't go near females," he told Tanzan, "especially not young and lovely ones. It is dangerous. Why did you do that?"

"I left the girl there," said Tanzan. "Are you still carrying her?"

 

There are several variations of this story in Buddhist writings. This one is a Zen story commonly used in teaching.

[Gaia]

Want to think?

 

Why was this particular monk still carrying her?

 

Was it because he was jealous that he didn't do it? Because he did what he was taught to be right? and yet Tanzen got to carry the lovely lady over the muddy road and he didn't get to feel the warmth of her body against his? Or feel the luxurious silkiness of the kimono? or the whisper of a thank you against his ear? or the last breath of the smell of her hair as she smiled and walked away?

 

What could be your questions?

[jonzen]

I think the story is an example of staying in the present moment. It also speaks of compassion. Tanzan helped another person in need in a situation that presented itself, then continued on his path. Ekido held his thoughts and allowed them to grow in his mind and his heart, he allowed his mind to live in the past moment and so caused suffering for himself.

 

I think the lesson is a practice in compassion and a reminder to stay in the present moment.

[Gaia]

Yes it is obvious that it a buddhist story of staying in the present. But look into it more. Why was the monk able to stay in the present moment? Why was the other one not able to?

What can we learn from the monk who carried the girl's image in his head? and not from the monk who did not. How are we to be able to be aware of our own actions as they happen in the moment, and not somewhere in the future as it will then be past and will then be made aware to us.

I have found for me, that it is worry. I worry about my kids. I worry about the nation. I worry about the genocide in Darfur. I worry about AIDS in African. I worry about alot of things. I have found that worry is about not being in the present, and in the reality of what is happening at the present moment. I try not to worry about my children until something warrants it at the moment and actions will then be needed. I am aware of all the injustices in the world, but my present moment is keeping my world full of justices by getting the laundry done and possibly looking to the future for dinner plans.

Was Ekido worried about Tanzan? Perhaps, because it is dangerous to be near females.

[JW]

This is truly a matter of perception wouldn't you think?

The lesson is definitely on staying in the present.

My perception was that Ekido is the student who is trying to make sense of what he is learning. Ekido is faced with the reality that the world is not either "black or white" .... it is sometimes grey.

 

Funny how we perceive things in a different way.

[Gaia]

Yes, perception. Sigh.

So how does this story relate to your life? How will knowing this story help you in your life? How did you incorporate it into your life?

Make it real, give an example, not an abstract thought or guideline for future living. Make it the present moment.

[JW]

Hmmmm..... are you still carrying that story????

 

Actually, I work hard at this every day.

I use a personal statement of "let it go"

I say this to myself several times a day whenever I feel stressed or feel upset about something.

This story is an affirmation to me.

[JW]

This is kind of fun!

 

And the best part is ..there are THOUSANDS of stories out there!

[Gaia]

Yes I am carrying that story.

I take those stories and carry them around for awhile. I digest them and see how they sit with my Self. I always ask myself if this is something that resonates with my Self? and can I put it in my life? I have read many stories for several years now, and only the ones that resonated with Me are in my memory somewhere and are available to me when I am stressed or suffering. One day I will be in a place where I won't need them anymore.

 

My favorite is the farmer that has a wife and son. And the farmer's favorite saying is "Maybe yes, maybe no" to everything that happens to the farmer's family. Know this one?

[JW]

That story sounds very familiar to me but I just can't place it.

Do you know the origin or where you read it?

 

For some reason I've always enjoyed reading "The Mustard Seed"

It's a pretty common story but it brings a pretty powerful message.