HELP! HARDGAINER trying to make the dive into VEGANISM!

[trying2bvegan]

Hey all,

 

My whole family is vegan. I'm the one holdout. I'm now overly convinced on many grounds that veganism is the way to go.

 

In the gym...I'm the definition of a hardgainer. 6'2" and 180lbs (previously 168, got to 180 after 6 months of eating every 2 hours haha), around 10-12% body fat.

 

How can I provide myself with the right vegan nutrition (calories, macronutrient ratios) to gain muscle?? My long-term goal is to get up to 200lbs. I'm a real beginner at this. Any help fellow hardgainers can provide would be IMMENSELY appreciated.

 

Thanks so much!

[Ruz]

One of the members on this site has a signature which goes something like this "there is no such thing as a hard gainer..just people too lazy to investigate what works best for them" I think its very true.

As long as you take a good protein supplement I don't see any problem with putting on the muscle you require. If you're looking to bulk up you should probably be eating quite a few carbs..beyond that its a case of investigating recipes and finding out what you like. The internet is full of vegan recipe sites, just try not to go crazy with so much choice!

Also, even the best diet in the world won't make up for sloppy, ineffective training. Keep a detailed log and if you see you are not progressing with one training system, switch to another. I'm having immense strenngth gains at the moment using Doggcrapp training so maybe if you are looking for something new to try you should check it out. its like one week I do 2 extra reps and the next week I bump up the weight. My strength gains have never been so fast!

[trying2bvegan]

thanks ruz. i saw that user's signature earlier today and it made me laugh. it's probably true for most self-proclaimed "hardgainers." i'm not saying its not also true for me, but i'm about as methodical as one can get when it comes to tracking my progress and goals, both with regards to food intake and in the gym. i'm extremely happy with my strength gains in the gym - if you're curious as at all i've been using Eric Cressey's Maximum Strength program, a 16-week program that is all about varying exercises and intensities so as to constantly keep your body adapting. perhaps at the end of my program i'll check out Doggcrapp...i'm always up for something new.

 

the main reason for my post though was to get a sense of what TRUE "hardgainers" (i.e., those that have actually put in a solid year or more of 4-6/day a week dedication into the gym and been methodical about it) have consumed to fuel substantial muscle growth. i have been doing exactly that since January 1 and have only managed to put on 12 pounds of muscle and am concerned i'm plateauing at a weight of 180.

 

would any knowledgeable, true hardgainer folks out there be able to recommend a macronutrient ratio for a fellow uber-ectomorph? i'm all about dedication and tracking...i just need to put the right type/amount of (vegan) fuel in my body to get me there...

[blabbate]

First of all, 12 pounds of muscle in 6 months isn't bad. Second, what are you eating? How many calories? How many meals?

[trying2bvegan]

Well sadly Bruce I wasn't vegan until about this week, haha, but I'm committed now.

 

Here's what I ate, pardon the non-vegan grossness...believe me I'm ashamed :

 

7am:

3 eggs, 2 egg whites

1/2 pepper

4 large mushrooms

1/2 tomato

1 cup spinach

1 slice 12-grain toast

 

10am:

1/2c almonds

1/2c walnuts

1/2c raisins

1-2T sunflower kernels

1 banana

1/2c plain greek yogurt (gross)

 

12pm:

1c brown rice

1-2c vegetarian chili (variety of beans, veggies, etc)

 

2:30pm:

turkey sandwich - 2 slices bread, 0.25lb turkey, 1T hummus, 1/2 cucumber, 1/3 tomato

 

4:30pm:

repeat of 10am meal, usually with different fruit

 

5:30-6:45ish --> kicking my ass in the gym

 

7:00pm:

Myoplex Original Shake (essentially whey/milk/soy protein isolates; 42g protein, 22g carbs, 4.5g fat)

 

9:00pm:

1c+ brown rice

lots of steamed vegetables

1/2 block tofu OR 1/2 thinger of tempeh

 

and of course lots of water throughout, occasionally some soymilk.

 

From calculations I've done (who knows how accurate the standard methodology is), I need to be around 3500cals or more for my activity level. I'd imagine I'd need at least if not substantially more to grow. Unfortunately I haven't figured out what the above diet breaks down to in terms of grams/cals of protein, carbs, and fat.

 

But the idea is I want to rid many of the above items from my diet and start anew

[Ruz]

Apart from the obvious..that looks like an excellent way to eat!

[blabbate]

I can't break the diet down by macro right now, but at a quick glance it seems you're pretty low on protein. About 25 from the eggs, 40 from nuts, 11 from yogurt, 42 from the shake, maybe 20 from the tofu, 16 from turkey. That's 154 total, call it 175 or so including the veggies and rice. On over 3500 calories/day, that's about 20% from protein, so there's a lot of room to add. Your fats looks like they're mostly coming from nuts, which is good. As a hardgainer, you probably need to up the carbs, since you're burning through them like crazy.

[VeganEssentials]

Ah, must be my signature that's being talked about!

 

Actually, it's not inferring laziness, rather, that sometimes there's just not enough experimentation by many people to find what's best for them, so they automatically assume that they're hardgainers. Not to say that some people aren't genetically predisposed to having a tougher time gaining than others, but too many people will think that they're hardgainers early on in their lifting "career" and assume that it doesn't get better (which isn't usually the case - it's just a matter of more trial-and-error!)

 

As blabbate mentioned, it looks like you may be a bit lower on protein IF you're one whose body wants more of it to grow. And, to second his statement, 12 lbs. of muscle in 6 months is pretty darned good for most people, so don't be discouraged. Heck, if you could find something that worked as well for the next 6 months, a 24 lb. lean mass gain in a year is fantastic!

 

Always remember, even the most perfect program for your body won't work optimally without the necessary calories, nutrients and rest, so if you don't gain fast enough but feel that your training program is going well enough, start adding more food or protein shakes to increase your intake by maybe 400-600 cal./day over what you'd previously been taking in. Sometimes a nice nudge of extra food can make all the difference, so that might be one thing that is a part of the equation that could use a little work. And, of course, if you've been doing the same program for some time, change things up! Nothing keeps giving the same returns time after time, so perhaps a switch-up in your training style is due. Haven't gone with low-rep, all-compound lift training? Give it a shot for 8 weeks and see what happens! Been doing low-rep, low set training? Change things up for a bit and go higher rep/higher volume for a bit and see what comes of it. Change is good when it comes to training, so don't be afraid to abandon something that's worked well in the past but is peaking for you now in favor of something different that's far from your usual course.

 

Hope this helps a bit!

[Marcina]

Ectomorphs thrive on carbs! I tried a low carb diet and I just lost all my energy and muscle. Booo!

 

So yeah, if you like potatoes, rice, oatmeal, bread.. GO FOR IT!!

[vegetus25]

Glad you are trying veganism.

 

To be honest you do not sound like a hardgainer, but you can find lots of infirmation about hardgainers at ironaddicts.com

 

Good luck,

 

Veg

[aryan]

Minus the non-vegan stuff your diet definitely looks healthy, but I'm surprised you can stick to it; I can't stand bad-tasting or boring food.

[scornell]

That diet looks pretty easy to turn vegan, so you really have nothing to worry about.

 

There are lots of great vegan proteins/meal replacements to check out. I might add one to increase your protein and make it easier to get calories in.

 

As a "hardgainer" myself, I find it hard sometimes to force myself to eat enough calories. I go through bouts where I"m just plain sick of eating, and that's when my growth stops. Just stay consistent with your eating and keep working hard and you'll be fine.