Think God would be vegan?

[michaelhobson]

Is it Richard? Or is it Emo Phillips? You decide!

 

http://www.veganbodybuilding.com/phpBB2/images/avatars/100916038943a2f5ce7489d.jpg

 

http://www.jrslastlaugh.com/images/Phillips_Emo.jpg

[Richard]

Not to diss that guy, but in the photo where I am pulling a STUPID FACE, yeah I do look like him When I have my street-face, I don't look like him though

[Gym hater]

Time to bring this thread back to life, again. I just thought of another reason for christians to be vegan. It may have already been posted, but I don't have the time to read 14 pages. And I feel like sharing this philosophic kind of theory.

 

If there are 40.000 kids dying of starvation everyday, and knowing that it takes 12-20 times as much ground to grow food for a vegan, you kill 11-19 people by not being vegan*. Knowing this and still not become vegan makes you just as much of a murderer as someone who shoots someone with a gun. And thou shalt not kill(or something like that).

 

If a meat eating christian says that it is not his intent to let those kids starve and therefore it is not killing, you can reply that if you shoot someone in the head without the intention to kill him/her it is still murder if that person dies(becouse you know he probably will).

 

*Still I have to add that if everyone goes vegan it doesn't automaticaly mean there is no more hunger, it is just when people remain to eat this way there HAS to be starvation in 3rd world countries.

 

 

40.000 a day is about 15 million a year, which is about the whole Netherlands.

[crashnburn]

I was born into a Hindu traditional family that is and was lacto-vegetarian for generations. Our family elders are so sensitive about it that they will not eat outside the home.. for the fear that some dead animal would have been cooked on some vessel at some outside restaurant by someone..

 

As soon as an animal is cooked the vessel becomes.. "ashudh" i.e impure.

 

Raising and praying to cows is part of the tradition.

 

Not to say that there is duality.. in the sense that 'domestic animals' form a large part of the 'labor power & transport' for 80% of Indias rural population.

 

Horses, cows, goats & buffaloes have been around for ages. But most indians.. (i.e. hindus dont consume red meat). There is a population that does consume 'chicken'. But most people are largely vegetarian.

 

One of the key Hindu gods was actually a gwala.. (cowherd) and hence cows have special status as a holy animal.

 

Also, Zen Buddhism talks about purity, avoiding excess, consuming minimal, not hurting other animals.. etc and is very vegetarian as well.

 

I believe I enjoy a mix of eastern & western philosophy and spirituality thanks to my grandfather.

 

SO COMING BACK TO WHETHER GOD WAS VEGAN ? PROBABLY VEGETARIAN.. AND WOULD PROBABLY EVEN GO VEGAN IF HE/SHE KNEW HOW HUMANS ARE ABUSING THE PLANET.

[crashnburn]

If most people actually saw the similarity in all of GOD's incarnations, messiahs, sons, messengers etc.. then they would realize that they all taught the same principles in different ways and different times.. because the AUDIENCES were different.

 

To sell a product in an american market needs a different branding and strategy than in the european or asian market.

 

This is how I think... GOD meant it to happen.. GLOBAL DOMINATION BY CUSTOMIZATION..

 

- Indo Aryans - Vedas, Upanishads

- India: Ramayana (Rama), Mahabharat (Krishna), Gita

- Middle East / Mid Asia: Moses, Jesus, Mary, Isa, Mohammed etc

- India, East Asia: Gautam Buddha, Buddhism and variations..

- and so on.. this is endless..

 

Same principles, same fundamentals.

 

Islam recognizes Jesus (as Isa) etc.

 

The only problem is everyone is defensive of their own so called 'religion'.

 

Religion is nothing but a way of life. You choose a variation of a mass / popular religion and you have an individual path.

 

We fail to see the similarities and see only the differences.. My way is better than yours..

 

A large part of this is due to the 'preachers' in each of these folds advocating a very THIS IS THE ONLY WAY stance. That makes them an AUTHORITY that you go ask questions and hence keeps their SOCIETAL position alive.

 

No disrespect but they exist in all folds.. Hindu, Buddhist, Christian, Islam etc ..

 

They are needed. But their purpose needs to be to help and support an individuals spirit...... not malign them from exploring individual paths.

 

I believe every human being can find their OWN PATH themselves. It takes a little more time and effort and you can choose to follow a SCHOOL of THOUGHT but have COMPASSION for OTHER SCHOOLS OF THOUGHT.

 

People talk of COMPASSION but hardliners from every school of thought have no compassion for the other schools of thought. They have a OUR WAY IS BETTER THAN THEIRS mentality.

 

Walk your path and let others walk theirs. They will bear the fruits of their karma.

[Kathryn]

I think "God" wouldn't eat, in the regular sense, but would absorb and create energy. Maybe wouldn't even do the absorbing part, just the creating.

[sinisterkungfu]

mythological beings have no dietary requirements.

[willpeavy]

What about Zeus? I heard he could eat a lot

[compassionategirl]

Walk your path and let others walk theirs. They will bear the fruits of their karma.

 

Not if their "path" involves the torturing of innocent beings, human or non. let me use an example that you may be able to relate to: I certainly wouldnt stand by and "let somebody walk their path" of kicking the crap out of their helpless infant child or dog, would you?

 

By the time they bear the "fruits of their own karma" the animals will have suffered already.

 

Doing good isnt always about karma - i.e. making sure you sow good seeeds now so you can reap the benefits later. I do this because the animals have no voice, no choice, and are totally at the mercy of their human oppressors. It isnt self-serving, it is altruistic, and many vegans go vegan or stay vegan for altruistic, not self-serving, reasons.

[compassionategirl]

you can choose to follow a SCHOOL of THOUGHT but have COMPASSION for OTHER SCHOOLS OF THOUGHT.

 

People talk of COMPASSION but hardliners from every school of thought have no compassion for the other schools of thought. They have a OUR WAY IS BETTER THAN THEIRS mentality.

 

 

Okay this is getting ridiculous crashnburn.

 

HAVE COMPASSION FOR OTHER SCHOOLS OF THOUGHT - Okay, so we should have compassion instead of moral outrage for the "school of thought" that says it is okay to torture innocent animals so long as we like the taste of their flesh or milk?

 

It really isnt rocket science - less violence is better than more violence when the victims are innocent. Less harm to innocent beings is better than more harm. WHAT PART OF THIS DO DISAGREE WITH/ NOT UNDERSTAND????

[craigrandolph]

http://www.goveg.com/jsfkosher.asp

 

There's a (relatively) big movement in judaism towards vegetarianism. PETA just sent me a 30 page pamphlet about it . . . for free.

[crashnburn]

mythological beings have no dietary requirements.

 

Not wanting to get into a debate.. but a lot of people would disagree with what you consider mythology.

[crashnburn]

you can choose to follow a SCHOOL of THOUGHT but have COMPASSION for OTHER SCHOOLS OF THOUGHT.

 

People talk of COMPASSION but hardliners from every school of thought have no compassion for the other schools of thought. They have a OUR WAY IS BETTER THAN THEIRS mentality.

 

 

Okay this is getting ridiculous crashnburn.

 

HAVE COMPASSION FOR OTHER SCHOOLS OF THOUGHT - Okay, so we should have compassion instead of moral outrage for the "school of thought" that says it is okay to torture innocent animals so long as we like the taste of their flesh or milk?

 

It really isnt rocket science - less violence is better than more violence when the victims are innocent. Less harm to innocent beings is better than more harm. WHAT PART OF THIS DO DISAGREE WITH/ NOT UNDERSTAND????

 

CG - This was not in terms of food /vegan etc. It was more of a religious protectionism and righteousness and hardlining people have in the way of life they follow. All mass religions or independent paths of religion teach the same basic principles.

[9nines]

I suppose without it people would still eat meat but it sure gives them an easy out. I've met more than one person who was deeply offended that I was vegan for ethical reasons because god "told" them they were supposed to eat meat.

.

 

I see this a lot also.

[9nines]

 

All the christians voted for Bush. http://www.mourningthevote.com/election.htm

(see moral values) And that's why 100,000+ have died so far in Iraq.

 

 

I am not sure, if it the cause in the USA but historically you see a rise in fundamental religion during hard time or uncertain times and see it more among poor than rich. Is the squeezing of the large middle class in the USA the conduit?

[Crash]

I suppose without it people would still eat meat but it sure gives them an easy out. I've met more than one person who was deeply offended that I was vegan for ethical reasons because god "told" them they were supposed to eat meat.

.

 

I see this a lot also.

Sadly I've heard this alot too. I really don't believe anyone ever said it was ok to eat meat -- just the rationalization for power, greed and taste buds of whoever started that destructive rumor.

 

All the christians voted for Bush.

BTW, this statement is false as I didn't vote for him in either election.

[sinisterkungfu]

mythological beings have no dietary requirements.

 

Not wanting to get into a debate.. but a lot of people would disagree with what you consider mythology.

 

Anything dealing with invisible, all-powerful beings in the sky can be considered mythology. Thor=Zeus=Vishnu=Jesus=The Flying Spaghetti Monster

[Jay]

Anything dealing with invisible, all-powerful beings in the sky can be considered mythology. Thor=Zeus=Vishnu=Jesus=The Flying Spaghetti Monster

No, no. The Invisible Pink Unicorn is the true one god.

[9nines]

Many people quote the Bible to confirm this or that. I have a hard time accepting Bible verses.

 

Recently I got a new translation of Kafka's The Trial. This edition is highly touted because the first English translations are being judged inferior (chapters in wrong order, word and grammar choice not portraying Kafka's work, etc.)

 

Now these are translations done within 75 years, from one single translation step involving one modern language to another and the different editions are noticeably different, even in whole chapters. Now you take the Bible, which has gone through a multitude of translation steps from one ancient language to another then to modern languages to yet others, with many of the modern language steps and probably all of the ancient language steps being done by authoritarian powers, who the very religions, supporting the Bible, state operated under free will (you think any biases were order by Monarchs, The Church etc.) Also many people, through the ages, decided which gospels and books would be part of the Bible (what about the likely many more books that were excluded.) After those situations making it almost certain that the Bible has been vastly miss-worded and has ignored many other gospels and books, etc., added to my skeptical nature, how can I take it literal or even not discount it as a parable?

 

With that said, I assume the original post in this thread was to ask for other ideas in supporting that your god would be vegan. I then assume, from those ideas you would advocate other religious believers that all should be vegan. Good cause but evil approach, in my opinion.

 

One of the main reason that organized religion is my biggest fear, as far as world following, is because I am, of the opinion, that many use it as a tool to justify their means, just as you would be doing if you try to use it to advocate others to change their diets. While your cause might be good, the ease at which man can use interpretation and faith to do his bidding, versus secular reason and logic which is more concrete, is frightening to me. I would rather face an army of secular reasoning enemies than share forces of believers who do not question.

[Crash]

Now you take the Bible, which has gone through a multitude of translation steps from one ancient language to another then to modern languages to yet others, with many of the modern language steps and probably all of the ancient language steps being done by authoritarian powers, who the very religions, supporting the Bible, state operated under free will (you think any biases were order by Monarchs, The Church etc.) Also many people, through the ages, decided which gospels and books would be part of the Bible (what about the likely many more books that were excluded.) After those situations making it almost certain that the Bible has been vastly miss-worded and has ignored many other gospels and books, etc., added to my skeptical nature, how can I take it literal or even not discount it as a parable?

Actually I agree with you here (and have used this argument many times with my parents - much to their dismay for my soul. )

One of the main reason that organized religion is my biggest fear, as far as world following, is because I am, of the opinion, that many use it as a tool to justify their means, just as you would be doing if you try to use it to advocate others to change their diets. I would rather face an army of secular reasoning enemies than share forces of believers who do not question.

Ok, mindless throngs that blindly follow do not appeal to me either, but I think the point of this thread was since many justify eating meat because they have been erroneously informed God said it's ok for them to eat meat - well, you have to refute the argument in terms of what those people can accept and understand. IMO this question is necessary given the arguments others have used to eat meat are from a religious stance.

 

But CG started this thread and I can't speak for her.

[willpeavy]

Anything dealing with invisible, all-powerful beings in the sky can be considered mythology. Thor=Zeus=Vishnu=Jesus=The Flying Spaghetti Monster

No, no. The Invisible Pink Unicorn is the true one god.

 

Yeah I heard the invisible pink unicorn is vegan. It gets its unique color from eating so many vegetables

[Crash]

Anything dealing with invisible, all-powerful beings in the sky can be considered mythology. Thor=Zeus=Vishnu=Jesus=The Flying Spaghetti Monster

No, no. The Invisible Pink Unicorn is the true one god.

 

Yeah I heard the invisible pink unicorn is vegan. It gets its unique color from eating so many vegetables

So what do followers of the Pink Unicorn call themselves ? The P U's ?

[craigrandolph]

It is well-nigh impossible to prove the existence (or lack thereof) of a higher power. It's just as easy to prove that a dragon lives in my ass. Therefore, I agree with the folks who are mocking the "God makes me vegan" theory. However, religion certainly does exist. Judaism is the religion i know best (since I'm on that team), and the principles it teaches certainly leads one to vegetarianism. The laws of kashrut (kosher) are designed to reduce the suffering of animals. The principles that religions espouse -- justice, charity, kindness, mercy -- almost force one to become veggie. Religion and vegetarianism are not only compatible, they have actual synergy.

[Crash]

If any religion teaches peace, love, no violence and no killing it should be compatible with veganism. IMO the way people rate(d) the rights of others and other species and their wanting to keep power messed the end results up (dragon butt ).

 

As for the "God made me vegan" argument -- why not ? Alot of us have encountered many people justifying their meat consumption based on what they say the Bible said -- and therefore God said -- it was ok to do. In fact some teach that everything God made He made specifically for human use and consumption as man was the pinnacle of His creations ( sad but true that some still teach this ). Let me assure you the way to refute the argument "God made me a carnivore" with these people is not that God does not exist. They probably would stop listening to what you had to say after that. IMO the way to change these peoples' minds is by making them understand that God did not make everything for human use and consumption, and it is not alright to enslave and/or kill other species -- they have just as much right to live and be happy.

[9nines]

Actually I see Christianity, at least the evangelical fundamental type I normally see (it is the growing part of the religion), as a force that impedes veganism, etc. Opposition to abortion and evolution are the biggest defining issues to this growing group. You could be a rapist, murderer, thief etc. and easily be accepted by repenting; they would still want to execute you but they would accept you until then. But if you believe in choice of abortion or evolution, many evangelical churches would literally ask you to leave. I think many of those Christians (again that is the growing segment) view eating and hunting animals as a virtue. If you were to abstain from eating animals or advocate humane treatment, you would risk showing empathy for animals and that might imply you believe in evolution.

 

For clarafication, I know that I am generalizing and that there are secular Christians but look at North America, the evangelical Christians are the growing segment and I am convinced that what I wrote applies to them.