robert Posted January 4, 2012 Share Posted January 4, 2012 An article about Vegan Bodybuilding, and members of this community featured in The New York Times. It is online now and will be in tomorrow's newspaper: http://www.nytimes.com/2012/01/05/sports/vegans-muscle-their-way-into-bodybuilding.html?_r=2&ref=sports Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
all zen Posted January 4, 2012 Share Posted January 4, 2012 (edited) . Edited October 28, 2016 by all zen Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baby Hercules Posted January 5, 2012 Share Posted January 5, 2012 (edited) Is this the root of the sudden surge in membership? Wish they'd gotten your pic up, Robert. Most of the piece was good. However, I look forward to the day when articles about vegan- and raw vegan-fueled sports are completely scientific and laudatory rather than curiosity pieces littered with outdated misinformation and thinly veiled prejudice. I believe things are improving, though: whenever I mention this forum around Portland, people are interested. Baby Herc Edited January 5, 2012 by Baby Hercules Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sosso Posted January 5, 2012 Share Posted January 5, 2012 I thought it was mostly good. The comments about vegans having to eat huge amounts of foods was kinda dumb. It's not like omni bodybuilders don't eat huge amounts of food. It's just a matter of choosing foods that are going to give you the most bang for your buck, so to speak. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
robert Posted January 5, 2012 Author Share Posted January 5, 2012 Thanks all. The 12 Days of Vegan Bodybuilding & Fitness is what brought all the new traffic to the forum. We were interviewed by the New York Times about a month ago and I knew the article was coming. In the meantime I figured I'd start and online fitness program and bring new members to the site. Now, I expect a whole new group to join and it should be pretty exciting. There are always going to be ups and downs in an article like this since they spoke with so many dozens of people on both sides of the vegan spectrum over the past 3-4 weeks. It if makes me think about their food choices and look at food and animals differently, I'm pleased and happy with it at the end of the day. Go pick up a copy tomorrow. Will be cool to see it in print! -Robert Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HorseSense Posted January 5, 2012 Share Posted January 5, 2012 I love the quote by Williams! “I’m no longer an athlete,” he said. “I’m a warrior now. There’s a big difference. The athletes are just out to get paid. Warriors stand for something.” Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sosso Posted January 5, 2012 Share Posted January 5, 2012 That line made me cringe to be honest. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baby Hercules Posted January 5, 2012 Share Posted January 5, 2012 It if makes [them] think about their food choices and look at food and animals differently, I'm pleased and happy with it at the end of the day. Indeed. Thanks for being positive. You rock. Baby Herc Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Richard Posted January 5, 2012 Share Posted January 5, 2012 Well for something like this to happen at all is a step, and it has a link to this site, so if people are genuinely interested, they can find out more. You have to remember that veganism is seen by the vast majority as extreme, pointless, or even dangerous. The article did have some negative BS in it, but I like it that it followed it up and did say "but others say..." It would be nice if they didn't have to stick in some jabs, but I don't think the mainstream is ready to take that kind supportive stand. You can't argue with Jimi or any of the others mentioned in the article, the pictures speak for themselves. That's actually the thing I was most surprised by - that there are not more photos. EDIT: The comments section at the end of the article is perhaps the most depressing aspect Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HorseSense Posted January 5, 2012 Share Posted January 5, 2012 EDIT: The comments section at the end of the article is perhaps the most depressing aspect I find a healthy way to look at the "comments" section of most things now is to see them as nothing more than entertainment. Anything beyond that and its just going to upset an intelligent person. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fallen_Horse Posted January 5, 2012 Share Posted January 5, 2012 I find a healthy way to look at the "comments" section of most things now is to see them as nothing more than entertainment. Anything beyond that and its just going to upset an intelligent person. So true! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Richard Posted January 5, 2012 Share Posted January 5, 2012 I just looked at the first few and gave up, I got better things to do Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
robert Posted January 5, 2012 Author Share Posted January 5, 2012 That line made me cringe to be honest. Me too. Disrespectful, and not an honest or accurate statement about 99.9999% of people who pursue and participate in sports. Bummer. As far as comments, I haven't looked at any. Anyone who has a YouTube channel knows that for the most part, it doesn't do any good to read comments Though, a friend pointed out how crazy the statement, “The amount of rice and beans you need to eat would fill up a Mexican restaurant,” made by one of the 'experts' should be challenged in a follow-up. Don't know if that would be effective or not, to write in a challenge, but something to consider I guess. Very happy for Jimi! Spoke with him for 30 minutes last night. He's doing great stuff. Not on the forum as he finishes up school and graduates soon, but I'm sure we'll hear from him on the forum later on this year. Thanks to everyone who has read the article and shared it. Hope some good things come from it. If not, we'll keep improving and do better next time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Richard Posted January 5, 2012 Share Posted January 5, 2012 Definitely think it's increasing traffic. Got a sudden increase in e-mails from people asking questions about veganism, and a couple more people wanting to be featured. I can imagine an avalanche tomorrow... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
robert Posted January 5, 2012 Author Share Posted January 5, 2012 Thanks for taking the brunt of the work, Richard! I appreciate it! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rippedveg Posted January 5, 2012 Share Posted January 5, 2012 I liked the article a lot and I liked the quote by William too. For some people who have made incredible transformations, you no longer see fitness and health (whatever type you pursue) as an athletic endeavor. You do come to see it as a mission and yourself as a warrior, especially if you're in a segment of society that often hears "you cannot do it." The comments weren't that bad...most of them are supportive. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HorseSense Posted January 6, 2012 Share Posted January 6, 2012 As far as comments, I haven't looked at any. Anyone who has a YouTube channel knows that for the most part, it doesn't do any good to read comments I'm a youtube junkie and have been for years (no TV - by choice), so that is the very site that taught me to give up taking the "comments" seriously at all. Its ok for affirmation or positive comments you liked about something and you want to give support but the endless childish debates that get started and go on into insult contests are a HUGE waste of time to even read. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sosso Posted January 6, 2012 Share Posted January 6, 2012 I liked the article a lot and I liked the quote by William too. For some people who have made incredible transformations, you no longer see fitness and health (whatever type you pursue) as an athletic endeavor. You do come to see it as a mission and yourself as a warrior, especially if you're in a segment of society that often hears "you cannot do it." The comments weren't that bad...most of them are supportive. Yes but to suggest that professional athletes are only in it for the money.. Come on.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
robert Posted January 6, 2012 Author Share Posted January 6, 2012 I didn't like the quote at all and was surprised some people were passing it around as positive, but I know back stories that likely none of you know, so it was almost more of "who" said it, and "why," than the actual words themselves. There are real, tangible reasons why I get nervous for the vegan movement and vegan bodybuilding image when Kenneth opens his mouth. I've known him for about 8 years now. I don't think we should ever put ourselves above the movement we claim to care about and want to support. You know why he made that comment? Because he wanted to be given a $10 million dollar contract for coming in 12th of 12 in a bodybuilding competition and the warrior reference is likely due to his involvement with "Warrior Food," from a company he represents I still don't think it was respectful to athletes and was a typical rah-rah vegan kind of statement. He and I were interviewed back in 2008 for this story. I wasn't competing. I knew Kenneth was, but was a little nervous about sending them his way, knowing the type of mentality he has. The did the story on Kenneth because he was competing. Here is a link to the article, and a quote from the article, which is a theme each time I hear him speak. http://motherjones.com/environment/2009/03/veg-o-might "Williams is also out for fame—huge, ridiculous fame, and all the money and influence that come with athletic stardom. "The legend of Kenneth Williams" is not a phrase he is uncomfortable using. It's only a matter of time, Williams believes, before big companies realize what a "conscious athlete" can do for their brand. "This is what I want: $10 million with $2 million cash in hand," Williams told me a few days before the Natural Olympia. "Imagine 'Nike Natural.' When Nike gives me a deal, I'll outsell Michael Jordan." Then he pitched me his ideas for hybrid car commercials." Don't get me wrong, I enjoy hanging out with Kenneth when I see him. Most recently it was back in October, just a few months away. But at age 44, he reminds me of myself at 21. There is a lot of grounding that needs to be done, ego set aside and focus on real issues that matter. Not just names in newspapers, but reducing animal suffering and cruelty. I think there are more effective ways of promoting the message, that's all. Just my $.02 RC Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HorseSense Posted January 6, 2012 Share Posted January 6, 2012 Wow do I feel like an ass now. Sorry Robert I didn't know that's where he was coming from. I totally understand, and I take back my comment! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
robert Posted January 6, 2012 Author Share Posted January 6, 2012 No problem at all! I've tried to be quiet for years. Gossip, in general, seems to be a bad thing and as I learn about Buddhism, I gossip or speak of others in any way other than positive, less and less these days. I've just been around the block so long and I'm usually interviewed for these stories and KW is often interviewed as well. I've seen the song and dance over and over again and I just don't think it's the right message. Many others feel the same. Just thought it had to be said because most didn't know where that comment came from, nor what it was referring to, and somehow thought it was OK to disrespect 99.99999% of people who play sports, professionally or on amateur levels. Again, just sharing what many already know. I want what's best for the movement, which is why I thought the angle of this story about Jimi was great. He's got a great physique, dedicates his life to fitness, has succeeded in bodybuilding, is very grounded, respectful and responsible, feels strongly about animal rights, health and fitness and is a nice guy. I see the future of Vegan Bodybuilding & Fitness (as far as media goes) being carried largely by Derek. I honestly want what is most effective. I don't care about names and faces in magazines or websites or TV commercials just to pat one's own back, but rather having the best voices speak the loudest. Derek is a far better representative of Vegan Bodybuilding than me, for example. Therefore I passed a lot of opportunities over to him this year and he's poised to continue to take things to a new level. There are a lot of great spokespeople in the movement and I'm glad they highlighted Jimi this week. That was really cool to see him get recognized for all his hard work. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rippedveg Posted January 6, 2012 Share Posted January 6, 2012 Wow do I feel like an ass now. Sorry Robert I didn't know that's where he was coming from. I totally understand, and I take back my comment!Ditto. I did not understand all of that at all and stand corrected. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
joelbct Posted January 6, 2012 Share Posted January 6, 2012 You have to remember that veganism is seen by the vast majority as extreme, pointless, or even dangerous. The trainer quoted as saying veganism is an extreme diet amused me. To imply that the standard american diet, or a super-animal-heavy bodybuilding diet is less "extreme" than eating fruits, vegetables, nuts, legumes, grains... people are so skilled at deluding themselves. As for comments, I wasted an afternoon last week in a heated comment debate on a Marc Bekoff article in the Atlantic, where he responds to those two former vegetarian women who advocate grass-fed beef or something. The usual suspects of anemic logical fallacies... the bible says its ok, vegans don't make any difference, you can't be perfect so why try, vegans are somehow less ethical than meat eaters, veganism is unhealthy or impractical, etc etc.... In any case, what a waste of time :/ But I did get in some 5-star debating gems... 18 disqus comments, 104 likes received Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
robert Posted January 7, 2012 Author Share Posted January 7, 2012 Thanks for sharing! Yeah, I get really tired of that idea that vegan is "extreme" or dangerous. Look at the American population. Something like 270 million people of only 310 million have some sort of diet/lifestyle related illness. This makes me want to vomit all over myself. I can't believe so many people have it completely backwards. I actually "can" believe it, because I know the how and why of it all, the turning point when the dairy industry created the greatest marketing campaign in the history of the modern world, etc. But I just can't help but think how pathetic it is that is 2012, "most" people still don't get it, and will live the rest of their lives feeling ill, taking drugs, suffering and dying early. It makes me want to cry, makes me angry, and also motivates me to work my face off to try to spread a more positive message and give home to a new generation who will hopefully live and think differently than most people do today. Congrats on your debating work! Great stuff! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baby Hercules Posted January 7, 2012 Share Posted January 7, 2012 motivates me to work my face off Not your beautiful face! Hey, you know by now that you can't educate all the idiots all the time. It's a law of nature or physics or something. The best you can do--and it's a lot--is to be a beacon of inspiration for those who are ready to learn and eager to change. Just position yourself on the front lines, flex a bicep or two, and watch the converts rush forward to meet you. You're doing great work, Robert. The ones who get it, know it...and we love you for it. Baby Herc Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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