dontxhide Posted June 29, 2008 Share Posted June 29, 2008 Do the Americans here celebrate the 4th of July, and all that it supposedly means? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zack Posted June 29, 2008 Share Posted June 29, 2008 I doubt it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr. Pink Posted June 30, 2008 Share Posted June 30, 2008 Who doesn't like fireworks and blowing shit up Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
michaelhobson Posted June 30, 2008 Share Posted June 30, 2008 With the current state of our nation, there isn't much to celebrate. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SeaSiren Posted June 30, 2008 Share Posted June 30, 2008 Yes, I do It's a day for one heck of a party! or the more correct definition:http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Forth_of_July Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
beforewisdom Posted June 30, 2008 Share Posted June 30, 2008 Last year I got into a bit of a debate with a well educated vegan who posted an essay by Dr. Howard Zinn ( "People's History Of The US"). I am a fan of Dr. Zinn, but I did not agree with his essay or that vegan that people in powerful countries don't have the luxury of patriotism. I also disagreed that the 4th of July was a pro-war celebration. I told this vegan that I was going to go to the fireworks on the Washington D.C mall, have a good time, and the next morning I would still be a liberal, still be against Bush, still be against the war. You know what? I was right. I would also bet my IRA that he and his wife did not spend the 4th quietly at home reading journal articles either. Being patriotic isn't the same thing as being pro-war and endorsing everything your government does or has done. Who I am defines what an American is just as much as anyone else who has citizenship here. Being an American is part of who I am and I have no problem about celebrating that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hsorlando Posted July 1, 2008 Share Posted July 1, 2008 I may possible go see some fireworks over a lake in Downtown, Orlando. It's funny growing up I hated fireworks, I was scared of them. But that could be because they were very close, and right near trees, and a lot of stuff that could catch fire lol. I just feel bad about the wildlife getting scared away, and possiibly getting hurt. I also like to think all the birds are smart enough to know somethings going on and fly away from the area. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
markc7 Posted July 1, 2008 Share Posted July 1, 2008 Last year I got into a bit of a debate with a well educated vegan who posted an essay by Dr. Howard Zinn ( "People's History Of The US"). I am a fan of Dr. Zinn, but I did not agree with his essay or that vegan that people in powerful countries don't have the luxury of patriotism. I also disagreed that the 4th of July was a pro-war celebration. I told this vegan that I was going to go to the fireworks on the Washington D.C mall, have a good time, and the next morning I would still be a liberal, still be against Bush, still be against the war. You know what? I was right. I would also bet my IRA that he and his wife did not spend the 4th quietly at home reading journal articles either. Being patriotic isn't the same thing as being pro-war and endorsing everything your government does or has done. Who I am defines what an American is just as much as anyone else who has citizenship here. Being an American is part of who I am and I have no problem about celebrating that. I'm glad you wrote this, and wrote it much better than I could. I often get pissed off when I hear people equating patriotism with certain partisan political views. The right wing and the media have done a great job of convincing people that only one set of views is patriotic, and that if you show patriotism you therefore must hold those particular views. It's a damn shame that liberals have swallowed that story so completely. I'm going to catch hell from some people tomorrow when I walk around on Canada Day wearing my Canada/US flag bandanna, which somehow makes many people think that I am a Bush supporter. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
michaelhobson Posted July 1, 2008 Share Posted July 1, 2008 From the Merriam-Webster dictionary: Patriotism - love for or devotion to one's country I just don't see any point in either. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr. Pink Posted July 1, 2008 Share Posted July 1, 2008 The Fourth of July hasn't been about Patriotic love or Americanism for a long time. The true meaning of it is to celebrate American and what-not. But the truth is that probably only a handful of people who celebrate this holiday keep the original meaning in mind. The rest of the masses consider the Fourth of July as yet another chance to get drunk, have wild and crazy parties and just hang out with a ton of your friends( That's what I'm doing. I'm meeting a few old friends who I have not seen in years and The fourth is the perfect opportunity for a mass meeting. ) You don't have to be Patriotic to get out, have a good time and celebrate the Fourth of July. That's like saying," I don't want to get presents on Christmas. Christmas is our Lord Jesus Chist's Birthday. So why are we all getting presents? He should get presents". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
michaelhobson Posted July 1, 2008 Share Posted July 1, 2008 You don't have to be Patriotic to get out, have a good time and celebrate the Fourth of July. That's like saying," I don't want to get presents on Christmas. Christmas is our Lord Jesus Chist's Birthday. So why are we all getting presents? He should get presents". Heh, we don't do Jesus's birthday either, or our own birthdays for that matter. I was born. So what? It was 36 years ago, who cares?. Christmas is my all time favorite holiday to hate, I'd much sooner celebrate 4th of July. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
offense74 Posted July 1, 2008 Share Posted July 1, 2008 The US has a lot to be proud of. It's one of the most diverse countries in the world. Surely you could think of something to celebrate and be proud of. I could think of plenty Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
veggieprincess Posted July 1, 2008 Share Posted July 1, 2008 Well I for one will be celebrating the 4th of July. It has always been my favorite holiday... it continues to be one of my favorite holidays... me being the environmentalist and all... I love seeing the sky lit up.... I love singing the star-spangled banner.... I love what our forefathers were TRYING to create a long time ago and what it represents and I love honoring that.... Yep! I'll always celebrate it. I'll always get a lump in my throat when I here the star spangled banner. I will always love the 4th of July! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
beforewisdom Posted July 1, 2008 Share Posted July 1, 2008 From the Merriam-Webster dictionary: Patriotism - love for or devotion to one's country I just don't see any point in either. Your country is where you and the people you care about live. A "love for or devotion to" one's country benefits you and your loved ones. So, doing things like being green, helping the poor, joining the ACLU, etc is also patriotic. You love your country enough to do something to make it a better place. True, the word is only commonly used as an emotional blackmail tool to get young men to join wars usually not for their benefit, but these other activities fit the definition also. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
markc7 Posted July 1, 2008 Share Posted July 1, 2008 but these other activities fit the definition also. Didn't Thomas Jefferson define dissent as the most sincere form of patriotism? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dedicated01 Posted July 1, 2008 Share Posted July 1, 2008 I will be celebrating like all Americans Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
veganmama Posted July 1, 2008 Share Posted July 1, 2008 (edited) I bet your mom cares Wait, unless she doesn't celebrate your birthday, in that case nevermind. BUT if I were your mom, I would care Edited July 2, 2008 by veganmama Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr. Pink Posted July 2, 2008 Share Posted July 2, 2008 I'll stop celebrating my Birthday when I die. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Endy Posted July 2, 2008 Share Posted July 2, 2008 PARTY!!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hsorlando Posted July 2, 2008 Share Posted July 2, 2008 This week sometime I will probably watch 1776. This is such a good movie about writing the Declaration of Independence, and freeing the United States. It's also a musical which I love, so in all one of my favorite patriotic movies. I generally don't go for the blood and guts war movies, although they can be very informative in a different kind of way. On July Fourth I will have the day off, but workout anyway. So I'll spend the morning at the gym, then relax the rest of the day, possibly watching some fireworks, this will very likely be done with me watching them on tv. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
michaelhobson Posted July 2, 2008 Share Posted July 2, 2008 Your country is where you and the people you care about live. Except it's not, people I care about live in all parts of the world. Patriotism seems part of an archaic nation against nation system that just can't die fast enough. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cubby2112 Posted July 2, 2008 Share Posted July 2, 2008 Your country is where you and the people you care about live. Except it's not, people I care about live in all parts of the world. Patriotism seems part of an archaic nation against nation system that just can't die fast enough. That is exactly why I don't consider myself patriotic. I don't like the idea of celebrating the separation of the world into countries. I don't really see myself as an American and people from Canada as Canadians. The separation feels arbitrary to me. I only call myself American because it tells people where I live, it doesn't define who I am. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
beforewisdom Posted July 2, 2008 Share Posted July 2, 2008 Being American is also your culture. Having one culture or being patriotic doesn't necessitate devaluing others. I really like many parts of American culture, but I also like parts of many other cultures, particularly European aside from that twisted bit about drinking things at room temperature. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CollegeB Posted July 2, 2008 Share Posted July 2, 2008 As Dr. Pink said "Who doesn't like fireworks and blowing shit up?" I know there are folks who don't but i'm not one. I'm not into the 4th to celebrate the current state of our nation, or the US government in general. I see it as a fun expression of the revolutionary spirit since I've gotten older. I see it around me now just in the past few nights people have set off fireworks, myself included. We don't wait for the 4th. What makes this interesting to me though is that in IL we don't have fireworks for sale (at least that I'm aware of). People go to other states and bring them in and we just set them off outside our homes. Which is forbidden. In the suburbs of TX where I grew up my neighbors would turn us in for that kind of thing as it was forbidden there too. I remember several years where even my dad would buy some harmless fireworks and my mom would be very upset, sadly, she eventually won out, but for good reason. Every year we'd see the cops roving around the alley ways listening for that popping or looking for smoke. They'd give out fines, but i'm not certain if they'd arrest people. They would do that though if they caught you buying fireworks where it was allowed in a different county. Around here in Illinois...still in a residential area, people don't care. My neighbors openly smoke pot which is another thing they shouldn't (legally) do. I appreciate that people are willing to break these stupid laws. I know it happens everyday but at least we've got a holiday to celebrate the fact. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
michaelhobson Posted July 3, 2008 Share Posted July 3, 2008 Being American is also your culture. I have so little in common with 99.9% of americans that I can't really consider american culture as something to celebrate. American culture to me is based around four things, jesus, sex, intoxication and meat eating. I just don't get it. I'd move, but most countries don't want american immigrants and being divorced, my kids wouldn't be able to come with me, so I'm stuck here. As Dr. Pink said "Who doesn't like fireworks and blowing shit up?" I know there are folks who don't but i'm not one. I'm not into the 4th to celebrate the current state of our nation, or the US government in general. I see it as a fun expression of the revolutionary spirit since I've gotten older...I appreciate that people are willing to break these stupid laws. I know it happens everyday but at least we've got a holiday to celebrate the fact. Okay, now this I could almost celebrate. When I was a teenager I built bombs in my garage and set them off in my yard. Fortunately we had 7 acres and almost no neighbors. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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