Ultimate Fighting

[ronnie kray]

I think flipping off the crowd was low end. I dont think that anyone expects more from him. I dont think that anyone is necessary excusing his conduct, they are just allowing the fact that he is a dumb wild animal. I mean if a lion suddening ate someone in the octogon we would be too shocked.

LOL!

 

Interesting point. Maybe you guys are right. perhaps the problem is mine for expecting too much from him. After all, it’s not like he really loves the sport. He’s only turned to MMA because pro football turned him down (at least they wouldn’t put up with his shenanigans, no matter how much money he brought to the table) and he long ago pissed off all his connections in pro wrestling. So for someone who is only in it for fame and money, I guess I should expect him to be a dick.

 

And hey, maybe he’ll quit MMA, just like he did with pro wrestling and football, when he stops getting his way.

[BJJVegan]

No worries. Shane Carwin will take out Lesnar after he takes out Cain.

[el_flaco]

I can’t tell if you’re being serious or sarcastic, LOL.

I know you can't.

 

Sweet baby jesus, i’m just repeating myself now. Maybe you should re-read my other posts. but again…

I think I can see why this thread is mainly composed of posts from yourself with no responses. You might want to treat other posters with a bit more respect. People have spent a long time building a reputation of sportsmanship and camaraderie on this forum, it's disappointing to see you display this negative persona. It's not something a lot of us want to be associated with.

 

You have posted saying Brock isn't respectful enough, I get that. I'll touch on it in a minute. But you also posted complaining about his weight advantage and the opportunities afforded to him. I was pointing out that those complaints seem misdirected.

 

I happen to agree with him regarding pay in the UFC. The issue for me isn't how much Brock makes, but how little the other fighters get. This is a direct result of UFC anti-competition practice. They are the only game in town, so they pay peanuts. Compare the UFC fighters to that of the top boxers. I have a friend who fought for the UFC when they came to the UK, he got paid less than a small-hall boxer in the UK.

 

I don't think that a fighter has to represent the UFC in any way. I want to know who the best fighters are. I want to see them fight each other. I couldn't give an arse whether they don the company tie, wear a smile and spout the corporate line. Maybe we have a difference in outlook there.

 

Brock doesn't owe anybody a favour. UFC elevated him to main event and title status for money and to advance their profile, not because Dana and Brock are golfing buddies.

 

As for flipping off the fans, if you go along to view a sportsman and hurl abuse at him, don't run crying to your mother when he dishes some back. I see this all the time with soccer fans when a footballer has the temerity to reply to their chants with a gesture. We want our streams of abuse to flow in one direction.

[ronnie kray]

I think I can see why this thread is mainly composed of posts from yourself with no responses. You might want to treat other posters with a bit more respect. People have spent a long time building a reputation of sportsmanship and camaraderie on this forum, it's disappointing to see you display this negative persona. It's not something a lot of us want to be associated with.

mostly posts from me with no responses? This thread didn’t start last week. Maybe you only come in this thread once in a blue moon, but I think you should review the first 42 pages of this thread, not just these last 2. You’ll see I’m hardly dominating the discussion here. you should come around more often, not just when brock fights. we have a great time here discussing the sport.

 

And I don’t see how anything I said has been disrespectful to anyone on this board. I haven’t been namecalling or using profanity against anyone in this thread. On the other hand, you did call me a nuthugger. which is ok, I wasn’t really offended. I actually thought it was kinda funny In the same way, I tried to be funny in return by posting the facepalm. Hope you didn’t take offense to that.

 

I happen to agree with him regarding pay in the UFC. The issue for me isn't how much Brock makes, but how little the other fighters get. This is a direct result of UFC anti-competition practice. They are the only game in town, so they pay peanuts. Compare the UFC fighters to that of the top boxers. I have a friend who fought for the UFC when they came to the UK, he got paid less than a small-hall boxer in the UK.

On this we can agree. UFC has a monopoly on MMA at the moment, which is evident on how many other organizations have gone under. Just today it was announced that Affliction was folding. It’s almost like a mobster’s way of doing business. Anyone tries to compete, run them out of town! They really have MMA on lockdown, and it results on them paying a few fighters well and most fighters a small amount. I believe this has something to do with why Roger Huerta is not renewing his contract with the UFC. Wow, we found some common ground.

 

I don't think that a fighter has to represent the UFC in any way. I want to know who the best fighters are. I want to see them fight each other. I couldn't give an arse whether they don the company tie, wear a smile and spout the corporate line. Maybe we have a difference in outlook there.

 

Brock doesn't owe anybody a favour. UFC elevated him to main event and title status for money and to advance their profile, not because Dana and Brock are golfing buddies.

I agree with the last sentence. obviously it’s all motivated by money, certainly not by what’s fair. on the rest of the paragraph, Yes that’s just where you and I differ in opinion. Of course nobody HAS to be respectful, but most realize they should be respectful and do so. And brock has even more reason to be respectful than most, after being given so many breaks. I find his behavior to be totally embarrassing to the sport, reflects the mind of a thugish school yard bully, and shows a complete lack of class that a champion should display. And yes, I think that’s important. You don’t find it to be a big deal, and I do. I guess we are destined to disagree on that topic.

 

As for flipping off the fans, if you go along to view a sportsman and hurl abuse at him, don't run crying to your mother when he dishes some back. I see this all the time with soccer fans when a footballer has the temerity to reply to their chants with a gesture. We want our streams of abuse to flow in one direction.

I won’t pretend to know much about how things work in football , or any other sport for that matter. MMA is the only sport I follow these days. I guess we’ve been spoiled with great sportsmanship in MMA. But that’s part of the reason I love it so much. Because we didn’t have the TO’s and the Ron Artest’s (I’m not even sure I’m getting those names right, that’s how little I know about other sports) and the divas that some sports do. That’s also why so many in the MMA community voiced their repulsion at lesnar’s classless behavior. I guess we’ve grown used to seeing the majority of fighters respect each other and show tremendous sportsmanship, and now it’s what we’ve come to expect. Is it wrong to expect that in a champion? I guess it is if the new champ is brock lesnar.

 

of course lesnar isn't the first to show bad sportsmanship, but the disrespectful ones have always been the exception to the rule. With brock leading the example, I can only hope it stays that way.

[sinisterkungfu]

Now maybe it's just me, but I think Barnett failing a test for steroids (for a SECOND time) and essentially putting an entire promotion out of business as a result is a lot worse for MMA than anything Lesnar could ever even conceive of doing...

[BJJVegan]

Haha touche my man touche

[ronnie kray]

I thought it was Barnett’s 3rd time coming up positive for steroids. Man, imagine what’s going thru his head. Though Affliction was in trouble already, he must feel so guilty that he put the last nail in their coffin.

 

Yeah, lesnar is def not putting them out of business, he’s bringing money in. though I can’t say I agree with his methods, he’s def gonna be selling tickets.

 

I’m glad they are changing the main event for UFC 103. I have to admit I was a bit underwhelmed when they announced the Henderson / Franklin rematch. I wonder what they’re changing it to. Rumor has it that Vitor Belfort or Tito Ortiz might be added to the card… but against who?

hmmmmm... http://bestsmileys.com/thinking/5.gif

[BJJVegan]

Rumor is henderson vs belfort and franklin vs ortiz. That is all through the grapevine so don't take it too much to heart. I do like those match ups better though.

[sinisterkungfu]

According to Franklin's camp as of like 2 days ago, they were unaware of the fight being changed or canceled. So if they're changing anything, they haven't bothered to tell Rich yet.

[pazios2002]

Rumor is henderson vs belfort and franklin vs ortiz. That is all through the grapevine so don't take it too much to heart. I do like those match ups better though.

 

Now I remember when Dana said that they were not in the Tito Ortiz business anymore. I guess he changed his mind.

 

So lets say that they are on. What are your picks?

[BJJVegan]

Very good question. I would pick vitor over henderson solely because I would much rather see belfort vs silva than I'd like to see henderson vs silva 2. Eventhough I like hendo as a fighter better.

As for ortiz vs franklin I would like to see franklin beat ortiz BUT I wouldn't at all be dissapointed if ortiz beat the tar outta franklin via ground n pound.

As for dana being back in the tito ortiz fight business it looks like they kissed and made up since in one of dana's "tweets" he said welcome back tito.

[el_flaco]

On the other hand, you did call me a nuthugger. which is ok, I wasn’t really offended. I actually thought it was kinda funny In the same way, I tried to be funny in return by posting the facepalm. Hope you didn’t take offense to that.

Nah no offense taken, just a bit of forum rough and tumble.

 

I think there's an argument to say that handing Brock the first Mir fight was no favour. Compare Brock's UFC debut with Crocop for example, and think about where they were in their respective careers. Who was more in need of a gentle opener? Brock was getting paid a lot more than established fighters, but as I say, the issue is the low pay of the other fighters imo. Dana loves to talk about how on a single UFC card you can have so many great matchups while a top boxing event might have one superfight and a poor undercard. He neglects to mention that the entire fighter budget for that card doesn't come to what the boxer will earn.

 

To me Brock poses the problem that heavyweight mma has to answer, that's why I enjoy seeing him fight (maybe "enjoy" is too strong a word). If we are going to pretend that the bottom game is viable at heavyweight we need to match it up with a dominant wrestler at the top of the weight scale.

 

I think you are overstating the level of sportsmanship in mma vs other sports. Off the top of my head, I don't remember much love between Marcus Davis and Dan Hardy recently, even after the fight. Junie Browning hasn't exactly covered himself with glory. Babalu holding onto the choke for too long, Henderson claiming the "late" punch on Bisping was to shut his mouth. Didn't Phil Baroni punch a ref?

[sinisterkungfu]

I think you are overstating the level of sportsmanship in mma vs other sports. Off the top of my head, I don't remember much love between Marcus Davis and Dan Hardy recently, even after the fight. Junie Browning hasn't exactly covered himself with glory. Babalu holding onto the choke for too long, Henderson claiming the "late" punch on Bisping was to shut his mouth. Didn't Phil Baroni punch a ref?

 

On that note, the latest round of shit talking between Ramapage and Mohammed Lawal is getting pretty intense.

 

http://rampage.fighthype.com/

[ronnie kray]

I do remember Davis and Hardy give each other a half assed hand shake and a “good fight” in post fight interviews. Seems Hardy was more willing to bury the hatchet than Davis (maybe because he won), but they did attempt to show some sportsmanship. I don’t know about Baroni, but I remember Gilbert Yvel having an altercation with a ref, horrible sportsmanship. and UGH… don’t get me started on Junie Browning. I stopped watching that whole season because of him. i can't believe how much they let him get away with. You can just look thru the ultimate fighter thread to see what I thought of him. He’s sorta like brock’s mini-me, equally dis-gusting behavior in 1/8 the size, haha.

 

I hear that there’s a UFC press conference being held on Friday. Hopefully that will answer the questions about who’s coming over and what’s the main event at UFC 103.

[el_flaco]

don’t get me started on Junie Browning. I stopped watching that whole season because of him. i can't believe how much they let him get away with.

Lol, I walked away from the show during that series too. Just not interested in watching that kind of behaviour, not even Kimbo can tempt me back. To be honest the format was getting old for me anyway. It took me a while, but I eventually realise the TUF guys weren't very good or very interesting. It bothers me a bit that they get so much post-TUF exposure.

[veganjkd]

In other news;

 

Tito Ortiz back in the UFC! YES! This is awesome,i really think its great that he is back!

 

Vitor belfort bac in UFC! Awesome! Good times,i am buzzing about the Belfort vs Franklin fight and Tito may well be fighting mark coleman.

 

[ronnie kray]

i think Rich Franklin vs Vitor Belfort is a lot better than the original main event. and he's been on a good streak as of late, so def good to bring him back.

 

Ortiz is back. i just hope he focuses more on his training than his trash talk. and please stop doing that silly gravedigger routine at the end of every fight he wins, haha.

 

they also signed Dan Lauzon, Ben Rothwell, and Paul Daley. i'm interested in seeing how all those fighters do in the UFC.

[sinisterkungfu]

i think Rich Franklin vs Vitor Belfort is a lot better than the original main event. and he's been on a good streak as of late, so def good to bring him back.

 

Ortiz is back. i just hope he focuses more on his training than his trash talk. and please stop doing that silly gravedigger routine at the end of every fight he wins, ,haha.

 

they also signed Dan Lauzon, Ben Rothwell, and Paul Daley. i'm interested in seeing how all those fighters do in the UFC.

 

 

Full list of Affliction guys Zuffa signed:

 

UFC

Paul Buentello

Dan Lauzon

Paul Daley

Chase Gormley

Ben Rothwell

Rafaello Oliveira

 

WEC

Javier Vazquez

L.C. Davis

Mark Hominick

[BJJVegan]

I don't see tito not talking trash. He really knows how to hype a fight. He just won't be talking trash about dana anymore.

[BJJVegan]

I'm not very thrilled about a catch weight fight between belfort and franklin. Just because its a catchweight really. Should be a real barn burner!

[ronnie kray]

this doesn't have much to do with anything, but i thought you guys might find it funny. i went to see Public Enemies last night. to my surprise, Don Frye has a small role in it. i recognized him right off the bat, he plays one of the hired guns from Texas that Christian Bale's character brings in to help hunt down John Dillinger. here's the best part... appropriately enough, his character's name is Mr. HURT, haha!

 

and oh yeah, there is an event this weekend. anybody watching?

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VmCr-Q3Rzh0

[pazios2002]

definately will be watching. Am more interested in this then other cards that have more hyped up matches. Been waiting to see Kenflo on BJ. BJ belongs at 155 as does Kenflo so both will be right at home. I also want to see Forrest try to avoid embarrassment in his fight against Anderson. You know my thoughts on a lower weight division fighter kicking the ass of a Higher weight (and typically greater lauded division) fighter.

[brandon]

I'm totally against a title holding champion fighting in a different division. When you do you leave a division without a champ. There may be a 175 lbs fighter who could kick the crap out of the 175 lbs champ, but he's off fooling about in another division and the contender never gets his shot. This is what happened when BJ Penn was toying in other weight classes. I like Anderson Silva and Forrest Griffin, and they'll get my money so I can see it, but any champ needs to stick to his weight class until he's beaten.

[ronnie kray]

^ interesting point i had not thought of before. after last night i heard talk of Anderson Silva moving up permanently to Light Heavyweight. i don't see the point in that, since he said current champ Machida and him are great friends and he would never fight him for the title. i don't think he should go into the division if he does not intend to go for the belt someday. i guess he could wait until Machida loses, but who knows how long that would be.

 

so did anyone see the event last night? i was a bit confused at first by Griffin's quick exit. i heard at first that it was an injury and he ran out to get medical attention, but those stories were not true. so i guess he was just too emotional to deal with this loss. remember him after the fight with Jardine?

 

i think i know what Florian was trying to do, but it just didn't work for him. too bad, he worked a long way to get his 2nd title shot and it must be heartbreaking for him to lose. i like how fast Penn was with the rear naked choke. he saw the opening, and BAM, we all knew it was over.

[veganjkd]

Another reason to hate Brock lesnar,this is from issue one of the UFC magazine;

 

`The best stake you can find is at ...I have some freinds in the cattle business in south dakota.you go there,find one you want,shoot that fucker right in the head,and drag it to the butchers shop`.

 

i wish someone would shoot him in the head.