Guest Posted December 5, 2007 Share Posted December 5, 2007 Just pointing out conflicts of interest thats all. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
robert Posted December 5, 2007 Share Posted December 5, 2007 I do think it is fair to mention that he never promoted whey on this site, just referred us to the link where his book is available. I know having whey on that site can bother people, but I think if any of us claim to be 100% vegan if everything that we do (including our jobs), we're not being honest with ourselves or anyone else. I'm sure as many as 50% of people here work for companies that would be considered non-vegan. That is just the way things go sometimes, and we try from the inside out, to change things in our work environment if we choose to and if we can. Obviously sometimes whey ads show up here in the Google Ads. I don't want that to happen or plan for it to happen, but because it is word-sensitive sometimes an ad will pop up that doesn't fit our theme, including possibly now since we're chatting about whey. It's not my intention, but it happens. We could get rid of all the ads, but they provide the website with some income to keep it running, so that is the way things go sometime.....and it doesn't cost anyone here anything (like taking donations would.....not that we'll turn down donations, but you get the point). Nobody from here pays anything, the ads sit there and get clicked on (hopefully mostly vegan ones) and we get compensated which means I can pay to host the site, pay Richard, make t-shirts, give out prizes for contests, etc. Just putting some things into perspective. drjoe, Thanks for putting the link out there for your book and mentioning that you are a "Vegan Bodybuilder" as part of the title. Very cool man! All the best with it! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
xveganjoshx Posted December 5, 2007 Share Posted December 5, 2007 Thanks for putting the link out there for your book and mentioning that you are a "Vegan Bodybuilder" as part of the title. Very cool man! All the best with it! Yes, very cool dr.joe! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted December 5, 2007 Share Posted December 5, 2007 I recognize a completely vegan life is damn near impossible. However its not that hard to not profit from the dairy industry. Lots of us work for non vegan companies but we aren't the breadwinners and we don't have as much control over what is carried. Plus I think its in everones best interest for a book promoting a plant based diet to be linked to a vegan company(financially and ethically). Just as(from a financial standpoint) bodybuilding supplement company would probably not fare so well in the hemp protein/rice/pea/flax oil market...which is why GNC has those kinds of products tucked away and not with huge signs pointing to them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
robert Posted December 5, 2007 Share Posted December 5, 2007 I do understand your point potter and I think it is a valid one but we all do things in our own way. Some people just became vegan recently and are tied into certain businesses. For example, Gabe, who has one of the finest vegan physiques on the planet (my friend from Eugene that a bunch of people have met) co-owned a supplement store. They sold tons of Whey stuff like Muscle Milk. He didn't like it but he was co-owner and that is what sold. They carried Vega and Clif Bars, and Organic food bars, etc. to show lots of vegan options. They even had hemp seeds. But to stay in business to allow themselves to present all these vegan items to people, they had some non-vegan stuff too. Once Gabe took over the store, he made it damn near ALL VEGAN. The store just closed down on December 1st. I was there 2 days before it closed to buy a bunch of Builder Bars. I was even in Eugene last night and bumped into someone who buys Vega there and told her it closed and she'll have to go somewhere else to get it. Just an example I thought of. I do see your point though potter. Just wanted to recognize that we don't live in a perfect world. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted December 5, 2007 Share Posted December 5, 2007 Thats very true but in this case he may even make more money if he didn't sell whey. In most situations thats not the case...as in Gabes...heck almost any vegan restaurant would make more money if they sold cheeseburgers. However selling a book strongly based on a plant based diet mixed with plant based supplements would only pad the pockets...unless of course the book is only a small portion of the business. If promoting the book is the main thing this would be optimal...if not...selling whatever non vegan stuff any other nutrion store sells would be financially optimal. Thing is they offer a small product line and its hard to separate one product from another. Its like VEGA. Thrive sells VEGA...if VEGA made even one non vegan product that they advertised the sale of other products would drop because a lot of vegans would go elsewhere to companies where they're consistant from a promotion of product standpoint. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pazios2002 Posted December 5, 2007 Share Posted December 5, 2007 Don't make your non vegan business on the site then...this a a vegan forum. We have non vegans here but they aren't showing us non vegan things to promote. Anyhow I wasn't a terrible site when I was big despite the fact that I didn't care what I looked like. I wanted to be good and I was. I've recieved medals at national championships events, was an all-american athlete with over a dozen full scholarship offers to major Universities, and recieved a few college athlete of the week awards for my conferance. I was no joke. Plus power wasn't my goal...throwing far was which means lifting was supplemental. I also threw 2-3 hours a day and was basically a child when I was that strong. If I were still doing this now and was 300lbs I would at minimum be benching 450lb and squatting 750lbs without strength being my main concern...and this is relatively weak for the level I would have been competing at. A person I beat a few times is now a World Championship Medalist(Christian Cantwell)...he benches 600lbs and I threw better than he did before I was injured. Anyway I had to be fast, flexible, have good balance and be an overall athlete. Plus your very short and much older...its much easier to do those lifts when your short and near peak power age...I figured you'd know that. Anyhow I've had my own business for 4 years and I know how a vegan business works. I've also been a board member for two large non profits so its not like I'm a dumb young moron that doesn't know anyting. Anyway I'd think you'd find a lot of people here agree with me more than you on this. Selling a non-vegan product in your store is very much on the fringe...as is emptying gelatin capsules for whats inside...whats the point of that anyway...gelatin does pretty much nothing for you(good or bad)...its just not vegan...like you. I have deleted my response and would like to say "I'm sorry" to everyone who may have read it, including veganpotter. Peace. stop doing that until I have a chance to read it. Always make a copy and send it to me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
offense74 Posted December 5, 2007 Share Posted December 5, 2007 We have had the discussion of "who's vegan" so many times before to no avail.Joe have built an amazing physique by working hard and eating plants and he is arguably the most successful body builder in here. That's all I need to know.Eating animal products is both unnecessary and unhealthy, we all know that. But 95% of the population don't, they still believe shit like whey is healthy and necessary for bone growth or whatever the latest issue of 'steroid man' is pimping. Since he's clients more often than not reads 'steroid man' he probably have to deliver whatever BS they're selling. All the while he can still promote and show that it isn't necessary. Are we suppose to throw every omni and veggie out of this place for not being perfect? I don't think it would accomplish much to be honest... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
robert Posted December 5, 2007 Share Posted December 5, 2007 I agree with Offense and so do many others I talk to about certain issues. I'm going to start a new thread because we have an issue of "vegans bashing other vegans" for some reason. I'm not just talking about this thread, at all. Mainly, I'm referring to the Portland, OR vegan population and talks I've had with other people who witness this as well and get really really annoyed by it. Sure, some of it is warranted is vegans are doing some mess-ed up stuff and are in the public eye, but most of it, is a waste of time and doesn't help the movement all, even if vegans think it does. It simply doesn't if you understand the meaning of the lifestyle. So we'll start another thread and get off Joe's back. He's made a book as a vegan bodybuilder before me or anyone else got around to doing it. He must be pretty dedicated to the cause and I know it's not all about money. He's on the most mainstream bodybuilding website in the world, www.bodybuilding.com and is defending veganism everyday on there. We can't criticize a guy doing more than many of us are doing. We can, but it would be foolish and would be a waste of time and not inline with what veganism is really about. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cubby2112 Posted December 5, 2007 Share Posted December 5, 2007 We have had the discussion of "who's vegan" so many times before to no avail.Joe have built an amazing physique by working hard and eating plants and he is arguably the most successful body builder in here. That's all I need to know.Eating animal products is both unnecessary and unhealthy, we all know that. But 95% of the population don't, they still believe shit like whey is healthy and necessary for bone growth or whatever the latest issue of 'steroid man' is pimping. Since he's clients more often than not reads 'steroid man' he probably have to deliver whatever BS they're selling. All the while he can still promote and show that it isn't necessary. Are we suppose to throw every omni and veggie out of this place for not being perfect? I don't think it would accomplish much to be honest... Nicely said, Offense. I help my friends to prepare non-vegan foods fairly often because I am the best cook in my apartment. If someone wants me to pick something up for them that isn't vegan, I will help them out. Does that take the title of vegan away from me? If so, so be it. I am not in it for the label. With being so overwhelmed by a world of non-vegans, it is nearly impossible to avoid animal products entirely. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hsorlando Posted December 5, 2007 Share Posted December 5, 2007 I think vegans need to stop fighting with each other,and stop disagreeing about petty things. Lets just show all the non vegans what we're all about, and we all have different ways of doing this too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted December 5, 2007 Share Posted December 5, 2007 I wouldn't call calling someone out as bashing. Its kinda like Mitt Romney being anti illegal imigrant and having illegal immigrants working on his property. Its no different than claiming being vegan and emptying out gelatin capsules. I'm sorry but thats common sense. I don't think anyone here would buy a cheese pizza and pull the cheese off just because that means you can maintain veganess. If that pill was required for survival then take it as is the gelatin doesn't care if its in your stomach or in the trash...but to take it because one wants to makes it not so vegan. If you were actually starving to death and the only food availabe was cheese then eat it...you need it to survive. But making the choice to do this makes someone not vegan plain simple. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
robert Posted December 5, 2007 Share Posted December 5, 2007 That is why I'm starting a new thread. In Portland, it can be chaotic. We have more vegans than probably anywhere on the planet, and there is a lot of in-fighting going on and vegan-bashing by other vegans. I've talked to some great people in this movement about it and they all agree it doesn't help veganism and really isn't even in line with the vegan lifestyle if we care about the overall reason why we live this way. It just doesn't add up. Granted, some criticism is deserved and should be pointed out and brought to the attention of others, but in "MOST" cases, it is nonsense and actually hurts the vegan movement. I see it nearly everyday in Portland and around the world and it's too bad most vegans don't understand what it means to be vegan or why they are even vegan, even when they think they do. No offense to anyone here directly, but just think about it. New thread to come. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
robert Posted December 5, 2007 Share Posted December 5, 2007 I wouldn't call calling someone out as bashing. Its kinda like Mitt Romney being anti illegal imigrant and having illegal immigrants working on his property. Its no different than claiming being vegan and emptying out gelatin capsules. I'm sorry but thats common sense. I don't think anyone here would buy a cheese pizza and pull the cheese off just because that means you can maintain veganess. If that pill was required for survival then take it as is the gelatin doesn't care if its in your stomach or in the trash...but to take it because one wants to makes it not so vegan. If you were actually starving to death and the only food availabe was cheese then eat it...you need it to survive. But making the choice to do this makes someone not vegan plain simple. I think there is way too much emphasis on a "label" and not enough on the actual meaning of the lifestyle and the very good things many people are doing. There should be more focus on the positive things that are going well and less focus on little tiny things. The whole theme of "I'm a better vegan than you" is killing this movement. I truly believe that because I "listen." I travel around the country and meet with lots of people and this seems to be understood by only few. We have to listen more, understand more, and not compare anyone's lifestyle to someone else's. In my opinion, it doesn't help our underlying message, and the movement, and in fact, it hurts it. Many people stop being vegan because of the label they get and the criticism they get and that is unfortunate. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hsorlando Posted December 5, 2007 Share Posted December 5, 2007 I agree 100%! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DV Posted December 5, 2007 Share Posted December 5, 2007 Dr. Joe, Thanks for posting about your book. I work at a place that has a division that conducts animal tests. I am sure that part of my salary comes from the fact that we get research grants to do those tests. I am sure that some vegans would judge me and believe that if they were me then they would not work where I do. I highly doubt that. I didn't read any of the responses that you deleted but I'm sure I know where you were coming from. Great physique! And I'm purchasing the book. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted December 5, 2007 Share Posted December 5, 2007 Its definitely not about the label and lots of people become vegan because its cool but consistancy is very important as well. I could have sworn the creator of the term vegan stated that avoiding all animal products possible was a requirement. If that doesn't hit the nail on the head then I suggest going back in time and telling the person who coined the term to change the definition to avoiding all animal products that you want to avoid. I'm sorry but people involved in the movement need to be consistant and part of the movement...not people that want to be part of the movement on a small scale with an obvious inner conflict of interest. I'm sorry but this is just common sense...if you can prove to me that this isn't I'll buy everyone at the next Vegan Vacation a cheese pizza and I'll pull the cheese off myself and we can all enjoy it together. This is the same crap with the vegan celebrity lists that have people on them that aren't vegan. Bill Maher is on the list even though he never said he was vegan. David Duchovney is on the list and I just saw him eat a custard Wolfgang Puck made on TV. They don't strengthen they only weaken.whats the point of having spokes people that don't practice what they preach or at least lie and hide it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
robert Posted December 5, 2007 Share Posted December 5, 2007 Please refer to this thread: http://www.veganbodybuilding.com/rob/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?t=8823 Otherwise let's stick to the fact that a new book came out by a vegan bodybuilder. That is a positive. All other discussions could be moved to the thread listed above, which I think is very important. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
veggieprincess Posted December 5, 2007 Share Posted December 5, 2007 I'm going to start a new thread because we have an issue of "vegans bashing other vegans" for some reason. I'm not just talking about this thread, at all. I agree 150% and I'm proud of you for making this statement Robert! You and I both think alike. The only way the Vegan community will grow is for more of us to start being more accepting and open-minded. I sometimes wish that more people would realize that words do have power, and that some statements build bridges, and other statements serve to alienate.... Its our choice of what we wanna do. Build bridges or alienate. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SouthSidde Posted August 21, 2023 Share Posted August 21, 2023 Hello, everyone! I would be very interested in joining your discussion about books. I would like to touch on the topic of PLR eBooks and say that using PLR content to create digital products and printables to sell is a great way to make a passive income. For the most part, you are able to purchase PLR content for an affordable price. Then you can be able to sell and make a profit. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BordasOo Posted August 21, 2023 Share Posted August 21, 2023 I couldn't resist jumping into this discussion about books and sharing my thoughts on PLR eBooks. Let me tell you, using PLR content to create and sell digital products and printables is an absolute game-changer when it comes to making a passive income. It's like having a secret stash of content that you can transform into profitable goodies. And when it comes to sourcing top-notch PLR content, PLR eBooks is the place to be. They offer a wide selection of affordable PLR eBooks that you can leverage to create your own digital empire. From e-books to printables, the possibilities are endless. So, if you're looking to tap into the world of passive income, take a leap and explore the wonders of PLR eBooks with PLR eBooks. Trust me, it's a game-changer for hustlers like us. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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